Yes, Sue, us'all are just arriving. At least here in D.C. through the downpour !
dr.j (ID=58) (Mar 21, 2000 8:41:41 AM)
Debbie, interesting, your public schools are out this week? Ours don't have a "mid-winter" or "sping" break until Easter time.
Sue (ID=59) (Mar 21, 2000 8:41:57 AM)
Ours too
debbie (ID=57) (Mar 21, 2000 8:42:04 AM)
We would like to continue the topic of models of CAPD this morning.
debbie (ID=57) (Mar 21, 2000 8:42:41 AM)
Our schools have a break now...then alot of planning days the rest of the year.
Sue (ID=59) (Mar 21, 2000 8:42:49 AM)
And by models of CAPD, you mean.....
debbie (ID=57) (Mar 21, 2000 8:43:49 AM)
different approaches by specialist to CAPD or different theories behind CAPD
dr.j (ID=58) (Mar 21, 2000 8:44:01 AM)
Sue, approaches that different professionals take in (1) defining or looking at what is and what is NOT capd; (2) evaluation and, thus, interpretation of CAPD based on the different approaches; (3) how remediation grows from these different models or approaches
debbie (ID=57) (Mar 21, 2000 8:46:26 AM)
The last few weeks in the morning chats....we've been taking a look at different approaches to CAPD in hopes of laying a solid foundation for parents to begin to understand the disorder
Sue (ID=59) (Mar 21, 2000 8:46:47 AM)
My daughter spends time with a lang path each week. 4 other non-CAPD kids are there, too. I believe that her time with the lang path should focus on CAPD. But I don't know what "training" I should ask for. ANy ideas? She's 10.
debbie (ID=57) (Mar 21, 2000 8:48:06 AM)
What type of therapy she will need will depend on what specific problems you are hoping the time with the slp will address......What areas does your daughter have trouble in?
dr.j (ID=58) (Mar 21, 2000 8:49:05 AM)
Sue, in response to your question.....The first and formost thing is to identify what approach to CAPD was used in defining your daughter as HAVING capd. In understanding that factor, you can understand what the professionals' interpretations are concerning what CAPD means for your daughter. This would help to clarify what the language specialist is supposed to be doing with her during her pull-out sessions.
Sue (ID=59) (Mar 21, 2000 8:49:38 AM)
Last year she was diagnosed with CAPD and language processing disorders. She is now in the process of further testing to see what other lang proc problems she has.
Sue (ID=59) (Mar 21, 2000 8:50:43 AM)
Last year they did the TAPS and the CELF-3 , that's it.
dr.j (ID=58) (Mar 21, 2000 8:51:31 AM)
Sue, when you say she was diagnosed with CAPD.......this is where it is important to understand the approach or model of CAPD that was used by the professional making the diagnosis. Why? Because, according to my approach and according to what many professionals in CAPD feel there is NO ONE SUCH THING as CAPD. There are categories or ..............
debbie (ID=57) (Mar 21, 2000 8:52:12 AM)
On those two tests..did she exhibit problems in an specific area or subtest?
Sue (ID=59) (Mar 21, 2000 8:52:22 AM)
I've always questioned (to myself) if they properly diagnosed her. But they are to do "the full evaluation" this time. Pyschological, Cognitive, Lang Update. SPecifically, shat tests, I don't know
Sue (ID=59) (Mar 21, 2000 8:53:11 AM)
Whoops, let me get ther folder
dr.j (ID=58) (Mar 21, 2000 8:53:34 AM)
Sue, based on what you just posted that all they did were the TAPS and the CELF-3, both of which are LANGUAGE tests and language processing tests NOT tests of CAPD, whoever diagnosed your daughter as having CAPD is taking what I call the SLP approach which does NOT differentiate CAPD from a language disorder. Thus, the SLP working with her is correct in providing therapy with 3 other language impaired kids since your daughter has been found to have a LANGUAGE problem NOT an AUditory Processing problem.
debbie (ID=57) (Mar 21, 2000 8:55:06 AM)
Sue, the reason I ask is that my daughter was also given the CELF test last year...but if our children displayed weak areas in different areas,,they the same therapy would not be appropriate..
Sue (ID=59) (Mar 21, 2000 8:55:19 AM)
Should I ask for a certain test to verify that she hads CAPD? If so, which one?
dr.j (ID=58) (Mar 21, 2000 8:56:06 AM)
Sue, however, IF they come up with the dx of CAPD, you have the right and DEMAND that they provide the audiological evidence that your daughter does or does not have auditory processing problems. From what you posted, they will be, again, doing JUST a language based evaluation although they are adding the psycho-educational and cognitive components this time (one step up from last year).
Sue (ID=59) (Mar 21, 2000 8:57:31 AM)
What does the audiological eval include?
dr.j (ID=58) (Mar 21, 2000 8:57:40 AM)
Sue, don't ask for these tests, ask the school district to provide the test information from audiological testing by a qualified audiologist who has the background and knowledge about central auditory processing and educational issues, not just ANY audiologist who knows how to give and score CAP tests. There are very very few audiologists who really understand CAPD and educational issues.
Sue (ID=59) (Mar 21, 2000 8:58:29 AM)
This should be provided by the school system, or do I have to go outside?
debbie (ID=57) (Mar 21, 2000 8:59:09 AM)
good question Sue...
dr.j (ID=58) (Mar 21, 2000 8:59:24 AM)
Sue, to begin. It may be worthwhile to briefly discuss the difference between the SLP approach to CAPD and the general audiological apporach to CAPD and specific audiological approaches to CAPD (which was the basis for last week's and this week's chat anyhow) and then we can focus specifically on what this means for your daughter? What do you two think about that ?
Sue (ID=59) (Mar 21, 2000 9:00:01 AM)
What is hindering me is that I don't know what I'm asking for> If the school says why do you fell she needs an audio eval, I don't know how to respond.
dr.j (ID=58) (Mar 21, 2000 9:00:12 AM)
Sue, it was the school system that brought up the dx of CAPD, right? Well, then they have opened the door. They will have to provide all appropriate dx. testing for your daughter at THEIR costs.
Sue (ID=59) (Mar 21, 2000 9:01:29 AM)
I do I tell them that their way of testing is meaningless?
Sue (ID=59) (Mar 21, 2000 9:02:20 AM)
I feel like I need a degree in Psyc to be telling them how to do their job
dr.j (ID=58) (Mar 21, 2000 9:03:50 AM)
Sue, your response is as follows: You have diagnosed my daughter as having a CAPD, an auditory based problem. So, I ask you, where is your evidence from auditory testing that my child has an auditory based problem? If they respond, the SLP eval is auditory based, ask the SLP how she controlled to separate out the language factors from the auditory factors in every one of her tests.....the answer is "She can't." Ask her the specific intensity level in dB at which she presented every one of her tests (can't be done because she never thought of this factor). Ask her if the tests were presented live voice or standard, controlled, recorded presentations via audiotapes or CDs (it was live voice as this is standard for SLP testing). Then, ask the school district to provide evidence that the people making the dx of CAPD (it was the SLP, you say) provide proof of expertise in the field of central auditory processing and hearing evaluation.
debbie (ID=57) (Mar 21, 2000 9:05:09 AM)
Dr J...when Sarah was tested a few years ago for CAPD, I accepted the dx as a valid and thourough dx..now I have to wonder if further testing should have been done based on the scores of the SCAN...I sought the orignal testing by the aud privately while the school did their testing...now do i request the school evaluate thoroughly or stay private.?
dr.j (ID=58) (Mar 21, 2000 9:05:29 AM)
Sue, if you really feel lost, you may need to bring in a consultant or a child advocate who knows and understands auditory processing vs. language processing vs. general information processing. This is the basis of the major problem I have seen as a professional working for both parents and school systems. The schools do not know what they are talking about, and throw around terms like CAPD.
Sue (ID=59) (Mar 21, 2000 9:06:49 AM)
And a consultant of child advocate should be a audiologist?
kc (ID=60) (Mar 21, 2000 9:08:31 AM)
(This user has entered CAPD: From the Heart)
debbie (ID=57) (Mar 21, 2000 9:08:53 AM)
A consultant or child advocate does not need to be an audiolgist, but does need to be someone familiar with the rights of your child and who understands the basic differences between types of disorders..
debbie (ID=57) (Mar 21, 2000 9:08:58 AM)
good morning kc
Sue (ID=59) (Mar 21, 2000 9:09:08 AM)
Hello
kc (ID=60) (Mar 21, 2000 9:09:28 AM)
Good morning Debbie - sounds like a hot topic - I thought about getting an advocate to help me with my son
dr.j (ID=58) (Mar 21, 2000 9:09:38 AM)
Debbie, If the school district has accepted, or in the case of Sue's daughter, the school district MADE the dx of CAPD or auditory processing or ANYTHING auditory in the termonology, then, it is the school district's responsibility to provide an appropraite diagnosis of the disorder by the appropriate and qualified professionals. The ONLY professional who can provide auditory test information that is valid, reliable and meaningful is an audiologist. The team should be the SLP to identify the language factors, a psychologist or neuropsychologist to identify the cognitive and learning factors and emotional factors, a social worker or counselor to identify the interpersonal and family factors (although the psychologist may be able to do this as well) and the audiologist to identify the hearing and auditory factors. Then this interdisciplinary group should be able to look at each piece of the puzzle and come up with specific underlying factors accounting for the behaviors that were presented that brought you
Sue (ID=59) (Mar 21, 2000 9:09:38 AM)
There are state organizations for this. But I don't know how much they actually assist.
debbie (ID=57) (Mar 21, 2000 9:11:02 AM)
Sue there are some advocacy groups that do an excellent job!
Sue (ID=59) (Mar 21, 2000 9:11:02 AM)
Do schools usually have audiologists?
dr.j (ID=58) (Mar 21, 2000 9:11:22 AM)
Sue, Debbie is correct. The consultant or child advocate just needs to really understand the different types of dx. that could be made and how these relate to your child and your child's "disabilitiy' under the law. The consultant should also know of the law and understand how to deal with school districts and teams in schools.
kc (ID=60) (Mar 21, 2000 9:11:30 AM)
After being dx as moderate to sever CAPD, the auditologist recommended visual processing testing. Are both usually found in CAPD children?
Sue (ID=59) (Mar 21, 2000 9:12:13 AM)
kc, did your school supply an audiologist?
kc (ID=60) (Mar 21, 2000 9:13:01 AM)
Sue, my school sent me to an audiologist to test for CAPD. It was their nickel. I hope they will pay for the visual test as well.
dr.j (ID=58) (Mar 21, 2000 9:13:34 AM)
Sue, schools may or may not have educational audiologists working for them. SOme may or may not have contracts with audiologists. However, most school or educational audiologists have backgrounds in working with children who are deaf or hard of hearing. There is no requirement from edcuational programs for audiologists to have coursework in CAPD, and the coursework in most programs related to CAPD is from the neurophysiological approach that we discussed last week in the chat and is in the archives of that chat.
kc (ID=60) (Mar 21, 2000 9:13:44 AM)
Sue, I don't know where you live, but I also went through my insurance and asked for the testing based on MEDICAL NECESSITY - they paid for it.
debbie (ID=57) (Mar 21, 2000 9:13:55 AM)
dr j...my school did do testing through a multi disciplinary approach,,,but their results vary greatly from what independent testing shows......that is where i am struggling to understand....how do i look at all the test scores that vary so much and make sense of them?
dr.j (ID=58) (Mar 21, 2000 9:16:02 AM)
Debbie, as would the results for any testing done by any professional. The variability is always up to the approach the professional takes, the knowledge the professional has of the various areas that may be involved, and the experiences the professional has......see next post.....
debbie (ID=57) (Mar 21, 2000 9:18:42 AM)
Sue, i can give you the number to the Federation for Children with Special Needs if you would like. They can refer you to a local advocate group
CJ'SDAD (ID=0) (Mar 21, 2000 9:55:53 AM)
(This user has entered CAPD: From the Heart)
ChatMaster (ID=1) (Mar 21, 2000 9:57:00 AM)
(This user has entered CAPD: From the Heart)
Marge (ID=2) (Mar 21, 2000 10:07:31 AM)
(This user has entered CAPD: From the Heart)
debbie (ID=3) (Mar 21, 2000 12:03:24 PM)
(This user has entered CAPD: From the Heart)
