Kasparov's Post-Match Interview 

This is the closing interview that GM Garry Kasparov gave with the ESPN Team of commentators, (GM Maurice Ashley, GM Yasser Seirawan, Author/computer expert Paul Hoffman); shortly after the end of game four with the computer program, Fritz_X3D.

<Items in brackets show action that occurred or things that were not said, but perhaps implied.>

I also have used "three-dots-in-a-row" quite a bit. This is used to show a slight pause.
(Garry did a lot of pausing and gesticulating with his hands. I did my best to make this transcript nearly word-for-word, I stopped the tape and hit <rewind/play> … more times than I care to count.)

GM Maurice Ashley:
"With us now is the World’s # 1 player, Garry Kasparov." <applause> "Garry – congratulations on a good finish in the match." <Garry smiles and slightly nods his head, the audience applauds.> "Garry, you were under tremendous pressure. You had to come back and win <big> in Game Three, and you did." <more clapping> Ashley: "You had never – in the last 10 or 11 games – defeated the computer with the Black pieces. So … you must have felt even more pressure, <to win> coming in playing in this game."

"I think in the next match, I should specifically request White … ah, in the last game. Mmmmm, haunting memories, because I played Deep Blue in ’97 … and then I played Deep Fritz here." (I think Kasparov means Fritx_X3D … please note that Kasparov’s first language is Russian, he sometimes ‘transposes’ things in English.) "And last January …" (A clear reference to his match with Deep Junior.) "I spent a lot of time yesterday and this morning trying to figure out what I had to do. Its like, ah …" <Garry shakes his head.> "Against a human opponent, that would be like overkill. I won game three, and I was in an excellent mood. But this damn computer … it just doesn’t understand." <Laughter from the audience and from the panel, especially Ashley and Seirawan.> "It always looks for the best move. And, uh … it was a very, very tough decision … to be made … in the preparations. Because I played a very long game – preparing for this game." (I think that Kasparov means that he spent many hours studying the chess board … getting ready for this game. Specifically, I think he spent a great deal of time looking at openings and studying the Fritz book – looking for a possible weakness.) "So it was many, many hours … trying to figure out, ah … deciding whether I should play risky chess … <or> whether I should go <all out> … and die with great honor, trying to beat the machine. And it was a very emotional morning. I spoke to my son … my 7-year-old son , from Moscow. <And his son told Garry:> <<Daddy, you better win today … but … you must NOT lose!!>>" <A great deal of laughter from both the panel and the audience.> "So … that was the order: YOU MUST NOT LOSE!" (Garry spoke these last few words with a great deal of emphasis.) <Laughter from the panel and the audience. Garry pauses – then resumes speaking.> "So … that was the order, er … <you know> a draw is good! But I was a bit surprised when the machine played 1.d4 – I was obviously expecting e4. And then I contemplated for a while. Maybe I should just play for a safe opening, like the Queen’s Gambit Accepted. But also! – there were some surprises there. The machine played a line it had never played before, Bishop-to-f4. It played different lines." <slight pause> (I think Garry is saying that the computer had played a different line than it had played previously, and really the computer gained the advantage of the surprise.)

Kasparov: "And I played this line once before, against Kramnik, <you know>. I beat him nicely in a game of Rapid Chess, sacrificing the Queen. And I guess, you know, that this was probably prepared <in advance>. And then it looks like a very short game." <Garry looks at Ashley, as if imploring him to understand.> (I think Garry is saying that while it looks like a fairly quick game, <but it wasn’t really > a great deal happened in the opening.) Kasparov resumes speaking: "But for me it was not so much a game of chess – as it was more of a gamble, because I did not know where the <the computer’s> opening book ended. So for me, that was the sixty-four thousand dollar question." (In other words, how far – and how deep – did the computer’s opening book go? And how well had the Fritz Team prepared the machine’s opening book?) Garry pauses slightly here. He had been gesturing a lot with his hands, as if trying to add emphasis to his words. Kasparov: "That’s why when the machine played Bg5, and I played …Rb8; and it … I even asked the arbiter whether or not the machine’s clock was ticking. Because this means that if the machine starts thinking, then it means that the opening book is over." (That the players have gone out of book – if the program’s response was not instantaneous.) Kasparov continues: "So I was relieved, <at this point> it means that there was no special preparation in that <particular> line."

Commentator Paul Hoffman:
"Was it psychological warfare … on the part of the machine … to repeat the Kramnik game; even though you won it?"

"I don’t know, its, its …
First of all, I also have to prepare for a number of openings."
<Hoffman can be heard agreeing in the background.>
Kasparov continues:
"Its not just about the machine, but also about the human team behind the machine."

Hoffman: "Sure." <He is agreeing with Garry at this point.>

Kasparov: "But I don’t know <where> when, and how they ended the <opening> preparation for the machine. So that’s why the moment I saw <that> the <opening> book was over … so I recognized that there would be no big surprises. And … I analyzed this position … even three years ago, and then I came back <to it> a couple of times … looking at some <different> lines, and I saw that Black has enough </sufficient> … defensive resources; although I think the machine could have caused some more problems. But the big question is: " (with great emphasis)
"WHERE DOES THE BOOK END?"
<Kasparov stops here, gives a big smile, and then nods his head.>

Commentator GM Maurice Ashley:
"Now that you have tied the match, how do you feel about … ‘Man-versus-machine’
battles … in general?"

Hoffman: "And when’s the rematch?"

Kasparov answers:
"Its … ah … I think that the matches I played - are quite similar. This one … and um, um, this one and the one that I played, um, last January against Deep Junior. I think that the human player was dominant. So when … so I had many, many opportunities … <so many> missed opportunities … and both losses resulted from terrible, terrible blunder(s) … that was due to tremendous pressure! So … I was not outplayed by the computer, and I kept <you know> a steady, steady initiative throughout both matches. So in ten games, it’s two wins for both sides, for me and the (2) computers. So I was quite happy with the general development of these <two> matches. So it’s still up to me to make the difference. If I don’t make a terrible blunder, I should win … or definitely not lose."

Commentator GM Yasser Seirawan:
"Does it concern you Garry that obviously – the computers are getting better and better? Faster hardware – and the software … is just BRILLIANT! I mean, all of these variables that they used to calculate the position?"

Kasparov answers:
"Oh sure, absolutely. Its quite amazing that the machine I lost to, …" (An obvious reference to the second match with Deep Blue.) "… is so inferior to those machines, you know. For anyone who wants to run an experiment, you just take the <final position of> Game Two, when I resigned, and Deep Blue actually did not see how I could draw. Fritz finds it in two minutes! So that’s why this machine is very, very, very good; but we are also learning! So that’s very important … that machines are getting better, but we – humans – are also learning and getting better. And today, I know more about computers – MUCH more – than six years ago."

<During this last part Ashley could be seen talking into his headset and nodding.>

*******

Commentator, GM Maurice Ashley, breaking in:   

"We indeed are learning." Ashley then briefly re-caps the match and says that,
"We will be back shortly to wrap things up."

(The end of the post-game interview with Kasparov.)

  REPLAY  all the games ... with analysis ... on the  Fritz_X3D  site.    

  Posted:  Wednesday;  December 24th, 2003.