Subj: World Wide Dreambuilders
Date: 97-08-04 01:02:35 EDT
From: To: exambot@aol.com ('exambot@aol.com')
With success comes sacrifice, with perseverance comes prosperity. Give
people some respect
and let them make their own decisions about any business venture they
may take. Amway and
World Wide are just one vehicle for financial freedom, it just happens
to be one average people
can take advantage of.
2500 pin and climbing,

Subj: (no subject)
Date: 97-08-05 13:50:45 EDT
From: To: exambot@aol.com
Bravo! Excellent synopsis. Your experience is very similar to ours. We
even contacted Amway to protest our treatment by upline, who had asked
us to give them a book of SIGNED BLANK CHECKS to avoid having to make a
3 hour drive each week (We had asked for WOD, which had been denied by
the Pearl upline because we 'had not earned it yet' even though we were
doing the 8 Britt Team steps, at least 1500 pv a month and lived 140
miles from pick-up and learned later that we had a much higher income
and credit rating than any of the upline through the Pearl. Later we
learned they were trying to get us to give them a high-powered phone
list to contact. Thank goodness we had decided to test the waters
before letting them contact any influential friends.) Anyway, the Amway
Distributor Relations rep said that the upline could deny WOD for any
reason. He pretended (but not very well) to be shocked about the checks
and said there were 'things' that could be done, but that it would
probably worsen our relationship with the upline and hurt our chances
for success, so we declined to pursue it. (Please do not publish our
E-mail address.)

Subj: Amway
Date: 97-08-08 21:15:26 EDT
From: BDBFREEDOM
To: Exambot
I have examined dozens of businesses over the years and find the Amway
opportunity to be as
good or better than I've seen. It sounds to me you went in with your
head in the sky. It's very
easy to blame others for your misfortunes. Get real - life is what you
make of it. Amway is
simply an opportunity. No more - no less. You obviously were unable to
make a go of it. So for
you the decision is to quit. that's ok.

Date: 97-08-09 20:32:05 EDT
From:To: Exambot@aol.com
Hello,I'm ,Today I had 2 Amway people here wanting to sell me
the package for 150.00.
One of them is a friend who has been doing this for 3 years and has not
really gotten too far,the other was from N.C.
I listened to the shpeel and asked my questions,and like you said
in all the statements"it will all work out,and in 2 years time you could
be making 100,000.00.
The one remaining question is how do I get people to buy from me
and not the supermarket?Also,how the hell am I going to convince them
that for 150.00,thier lives will be better?
Please respond,I need an answer in16 hours.
It is now 8:45pm sat.

Date: 97-08-11 15:33:28 EDT
From: To: Exambot@aol.com
No I wasn't asking you how to make it work,I don't know that too
many people can.
Thank you for your words of experience.I do think I understand the
system,in order to make any money you must keep recruiting people.
And yes I have noticed some of thier food products were kind of
expensive.

Subj: WWDB
Date: 97-08-12 00:58:38 EDT
From: To: exambot@aol.com
Great page -- Thanks for the help!!
My parents have gotten involved with this and I'm really
frightened!!
Keep up the good work!
AS

Subj: Just for you
Date: 97-08-12 16:45:52 EDT
From: To: exambot@aol.com
How many plans did you show?
Try to read more my baby. You can read whatever you want. Nobody decide
what you have to do .
Is you decision.
See you on Peter Island

Subj: Distortionist, Sad but True
Date: 97-08-12 18:08:55 EDT
From: To: Exambot
You are Lucky that you have not printed your name & address and Phone
number here, as
otherwise you would be the target of a multibillion dollar lawsuit.
To distort the facts & figures and not print return email address in
with your responses is
showning that you can only hide behing your email address.
I invest my time, my childrens time and my money from my business of my
own free will. If you
lost, then maybe you just did not work the plan. But only cowards hide
behind email address that
are difficult to trace. And as far as the Duncan's are concerned, they
are the most personable
friendly down to earth people I have ever met. Hopefully AOL will pull
your page before they are
a party to lawsuit for your distortionist agenda.

Subj: Great!!!!!!!!!1
Date: 97-08-13 02:22:26 EDT
From: To: Exambot
Hello! My name is . We have been in Amway for 1 1/2 years . we want out.
However the pressure you speak of is in fact great. Last year we did not
reup but our upline
sponse conveintly paid the fee. We are concerned about our relationship
with them and others.
please send e-mail for info on the best way to get out. Thanks
Stressed

Subj: amway
Date: 97-08-15 00:35:07 EDT
From: To: exambot@aol.com
In reading your page, I found it very informative.
We have been thinking about "doing" AMWAY. But tonight, when our
sponsor to be came by, I asked him a question. When I give him a name
to call for a potential prospect, and you call him, what is my
response back to him when he calls me and says " what the hell are you
giving my name out to this guy for?"
The response I got was "just tell him that (name) was looking for some
intelligent people that might be interested in expanding a business
locally. Why do you ask? What did he call you about?"
To me, it is a lie. I know why I gave him the name/number. To establish
a downline.... But then to turn around and say the above....
I take it, this is the normal routine. Doesn't sound like good
business to me.

Subj: Re: amway
Date: 97-08-16 19:49:52 EDT
From: To: Exambot@aol.com
Kelly:
The people that wanted us to start, I guess they would be called the
sponsor, told me that I just don't understand how things work. I backed
out
of going to a "board plan" and rally function this weekend.
They told me that this is why we need to attend these functions is to
see
how things work. I can see that a stern conversation maybe in order.
>have personally seen. These practices tend to alienate anyone who does
not
>decide to participate in the "business". Isolating it's members. I
guess
>that would be why they don't want you mentioning the Amway name until
it
>becomes absolutely neccessary. They have a well earned reputation.
When my wife asked about selling product, they didn't even touch that
topic.
They went right into how I need to spend time listening to tapes and
reading
books on how to "expand" my business. I told them it sounds to me that
they
want me to "participate" in funding their motivational tool program and
that's
why selling AMWAY products is next to last.
Thanks for your reply.

Subj: i thought your wwdb page was awesome
Date: 97-08-16 19:57:11 EDT
From: To: exambot@aol.com
thanks, i have a friend in amway who is relentless. good info

Subj: Long-winded responses
Date: 97-08-16 23:26:24 EDT
From: To: exambot@aol.com
Hi, it's me, from the STC. I was just browsing around for
some more inspiration (well, actually, just a little burnt out from a
long hard day and didn;t want to think too hard for awhile).
Anyway, I just have to ask: there's one guy who had some really long and
rambling responses - was his name ****** ******? There was this guy on
C'serve who was impenetrable, and I guess he was really good at
keyboarding because I would marvel at the length of his rambling
responses, and there was no way to get through to this guy.
Anyway, great site, hope to get mine rolling soon, and "see you on the
beaches" |;^D

Subj: amway stuff
Date: 97-08-19 03:39:21 EDT
From: To: exambot@AOL.COM
Thankyou very much for creating this page. My best friend for life has
gotten himself into Amway and now is taking me to the meetings (only
one, actually)..... I mentioned to him that the speaker only said
"amway" 1 or 2 times throughout the lecture....????? hmmmmm? so, I told
him I would surf the web. WOW!!!! 90% of the info is negative. I now
have the tough job to sit him in front of the computer.......
thanks again,

Subj: Amway--another small detail
Date: 97-08-19 12:19:19 EDT
From: To: Exambot
as a specialist in the field of audio recording,I have my own small
piece to add. I was
approached on August 17th by an Amway "representative" from the job that
I had recently
resigned from,and he presented his ever-popular BS string.As I told him
I might be interested
(pending further investigation,which I made damn sure I investigated all
that was
available,despite having no interest in the concept) he presented me
with two loaner tapes (the
motivational material which you have mentioned).On looking at these
tapes (I have not had time
to sequence the trackset,but I know the tapes themselves) I discovered
one thing very well
known about these...they are of 1981 standard,and the tracks on these
tapes are not set properly
for modern recording equipment (nor are they set properly for recording
equipment for that
particular time).What does this mean? This means that there are two
problems,which present a
subliminal hazard:
1) The tapes,while having ill-defined tracks,allow approximately 8
decibels of backward
transmission to be heard on the tape as it is being played forward
2) the ferrous tape (as opposed to the chromium dioxide modern standard
for high recording
quality) allows input from the erase head on the initial recorder (have
you noticed that the
silences include,at approximately 10-13dB,what you have heard about 4
seconds earlier?)
In effect,the material which you are hearing is tracked with an
overabundance of (whether
intentional or unintentional) subliminal programming,which will route
its way into the
subconscious mind of the listener.This is a situation which is highly
dangerous,and can be used
for "mind programming".
Thank you for your time.

Date: 97-08-20 01:05:39 EDT
From: To:
examine data concerning subliminal messaging,which is available at any
library...cross reference
the information on the 1985 research on "backward masking" and
subliminal messages in
regards to music.
I am the president and founder of the business,which specializes in
computer system repair and
network security.I know what actions take place in recording subliminal
messages due to
research into marketing and sales techniques,mostly used by the Muzac
corporation for their
subliminal tracks for use in department stores.
There is much information available on the subject--if you have any of
the cassettes (which,as I
have seen,are most likely white cassettes),play them at high volume and
listen in the silences.At
the end of a side which runs blank space for a duration of time in which
it takes for the other side
(the longer side) to return itself to "start",you should hear (at
approximately 8.3 decibels) the
beginning of the other side backwards. You can record this,and play it
back forwards using such
a utility as Sound Recorder on any PC.If you should hear another
sequence on there that is not
the continuation of the side which you are on forwards (nor the other
side backwards),then the
tape has been programmed with subliminal messages.
Another suggestion...try doing a web search for keywords "subliminal"
and "subconscious
programming" on the web...you may find some interesting stuff out!
I am not overly concerned as to whether or not you would take me
seriously or not...frankly,I
could't care less.However,if it is a case as to whether or not Amway is
using illegal subliminal
messages in their products,or is intentionally using the nature of the
recording materials as a
subliminal tool,then this could be quite a breakthrough in the fight
against such an interesting
organization like Amway. As I said,I have not been able to examine first
hand the recorded
material (I have a system installed on my computer for analyzing wave
patterns in
sound),however,I do know what kind of cassette was used...being also a
recording hobbyist,I
know what to listen for.
I apologise for this not having been written in an orderly
fashion,however I do hope that you will
find it useful.Thank you for your time.

Subj: Re: Letter to me concerning motivational tapes
Date: 97-08-20 11:37:22 EDT
From: To:
oh...another thing...the tapes that they use aren't the cheapest on the
market...there are
cassettes with better tracking (and encased in clear wrappers) that are
available by about 12¢
less by unit,so economics would not be the motivation for the use of the
tapes

Subj: Web Site
Date: 97-08-20 22:15:36 EDT
From: Reply-to: To: exambot@aol.com
Seems pretty much like my experience. We are no longer doing the system
"thing" but are still distributors. I like some of the products very
well. We make a little money but it is eaten up by the shipping costs
and such. So now I consider it just a shopping alternative for the stuff
of Amway's that I really like. (No need to post this response)

Subj: No Subject
Date: 97-08-22 05:57:50 EDT
From:To: Exambot
Amen brother. I thank God that my wife basically informed me that it was
either her or the
system. Well the ruts fine when you've won back your wife's respect,
have your life more
balanced, and aren't being blown over by a scam. Keep up the good work
brother

Subj: ScamWay
Date: 97-08-22 17:44:49 EDT
From: To: exambot@aol.com
Hi,
It is a very informative page about "Scamway". I too just got involved
in this so called "BUSINESS", couple month back. My uplines are pushing
for the FED which is being held in Richmond, VA. I agree with all waht
you said in your page.
The reason I joined was not for money or to really build it, but to just
see what exactly this "CULT" is. My upline pushed me to go on
contacting, on attending meetings, 100% product use, SOT (standing order
tapes and reading books. All this was cool, I thought ok I am learning
some good stuff, you know better than watching lots of TV, but what they
said to me really freaked me out. I am college student and in every
meeting and personal "COUNSELLING" they down played college and
education as bad.( I am very extreme when it comes to education, I
educate people to go and educate themselves) And this person is saying
to me to quit school and get completely involved. This was like some
body crossing the line, I still said may be they are little ignorant.
Then he started preaching about Brit how great he is, putiing him in
place of God (God forgive me) telling me about his personallity and waht
not. Next they get really personal,
they insisted I clean my moustache and my side burns, not that they were
not trimed or looked bad on "MY FACE" but just beacuse BRITT did not
liked them. Give me a break. I said to myself this is it. To hll with
these cult worshippers.
So ;png for my story, you indeed have done a great job. Keep it up. I am
also build idng a site, I am sure to put some stuff their too.
Scamway

__Subj: Your Page. . .
Date: 97-08-23 11:11:19 EDT
From: Reply-to: To: exambot@aol.com
I am impressed with your reasoning and succinct listings of how people
are "brainwashed" by Amway. One of my dearest friends and clients has
been entrenched in Amway for 7 years and has been "living the lie." He
and his wife are in the middle of an "Amriff" right now, as she is tired
of the falsehoods and the dishonesty. His Upline counseled him to not
take a 12,000 dollar promotion in his job, as it would take too much
time from the "Business" and to not buy his wife a used Cadilliac, as it
might create problems for his downline, as they might want one too. That
would be a bad thing, as then they might miss buying Amway products or
tapes or whatever, and my friends business would suffer. (And the
Upline's) I could not believe what I was hearing from him. He actually
refused to answer my phone calls to him for years, because he was afraid
I would tell him I was making more money than he in another
organization!
He is beginning to realize he has to do something else, and his
biggest fear is that his people will think he is a quitter! It doesn't
matter that he faces the possiblitity of losing his house. His Amway
friends will know he fought the good fight. I told him that if they were
really friends they would be concerned for his welfare and not Amway. He
didn't seem to understand that.
The bottom line was that when the defenses were down, and the tears
were flowing, he began beating himself up and calling himself a failure
because he wanted to quit, and when I asked him what the answer was to
his circumstances, expecting him to say he would lay it down, he said
"I'll listen to more tapes, and read more books, and that will make it
better." (Continuing to do the same thing for 7 years and expecting a
different result could be a defininition of insanity, couldn't it?) I
listened, ran some quick math, and found he has had a negative cash flow
over his entire career. Their average income is $300 a month gross, but
if you subtract tapes, books, major functions, travel, etc. . .
I'm hoping I can help them get out without major harrasement from his
Upline, as he is really tender, and I don't know how much he will take
without deepening his current depression to unthinkable depths and
perhaps thinking of a permanent solution to life.
I'm not involved with Amway, I'm seeing the results of its impact on my
friend. I pray to God we can get him out of this dilimma.
--
II*
Subj: your hp
Date: 97-08-29 14:01:40 EDT
From: Reply-to: To: exambot@aol.com
Fantastic, just fanntastic! I've been in Amway for three years, and what
you say is the reality! It's really an absurd! And I don't consider
myself a stupid! What can we do to avoid it?
Have you been inside for a long time? You catched the main things in a
very clear and ordinately way. Compliments for your work.
What did you do it for? Just to exorcisise? Tell me because I'm out
since last october and I still think about the absurd things we used to
do for it!
Ciao,

Subj: Re: Response from someone asking you for info on a "how to" get
someone out of
Date: 97-08-30 14:02:51 EDT
From: Reply-to: To: exambot@aol.com
I too am very interested in finding this out. I have lost my younger
sister to Amway and if there is anything you can recommend, I will be
forever grateful. I have already ordered two books recommended on the
Schwartz home page (about Cults and Mind Control), but if you have
anything
further to suggest, please e-mail asap.
Thanks for your time. Your site was a real "eye-opener".
Sincerely,