Eremia started this thread, with her beautiful story:
I have been lurking and reading in between trips to the desert and wheatbelt
nursing. One of my greatest loves (and I have many especially those monsters
with big humps) is Spiders. I may have mentioned on this list before about
all the companions that I have living with me and close by. My home is alive
and crawling with Spiders of all sorts. I never allow sprays of any sort
due to my resident frog population and the spiders.
My favourite are the "Golden Orb" Spiders that populate my surrounding
Mallee and Salmon Gums, and to my joy under the eves of my veranda. I have
many spider stories to share with you about the habits of the "Golden Orb".
They don't seem to be as shy as they used to be and now spin their golden
web in full view, such as across my window panes and so forth. This gives me
such joy as I can watch them for days at a time, spinning and creating their
long cocoon like structures with their food supply enclosed. After a couple
of weeks they seem to disappear, sometimes leaving the "tiny" male in the
web. I think that perhaps the resident ravens or other birds may find them
tasty supper.
A few months back a "Golden Orb" begun spinning a web across my gravel
driveway, from one sign posting to the other (about 6 metres). The left
sign said "Eremia Camel Farm..Dromedary Drive" and the right sign said
"Dingos Dog Kennels and Riley's Cattery". I placed a third sign up saying
"Traffic, please detour to the left of signs as Golden Orb Spinning".
Visitors and tourists respected my wishes and "she" stayed peacefully, for
about 2 mths. She became an attraction and tourists took photos and gazed in
awe of her golden, multidimensional, woven handiwork. Her web grew stronger
by the day and more golden, reflecting the morning sunrise. I truly grew to
love her, and my morning ritual was to walk up my long gravel driveway; just
to gaze awhile at her magical splendour.
Her large white abdomen grew fat, about 6 cm across. Sometimes in the
morning glow as I peered into her large eyes I was convinced that she was
peering back; as curious of me as I was of her! I was to learn later that
the tiny spider to the right of her, was her mate. I giggled at the thought
of having such a tiny "Lover"..:-)
Then one morning she was gone! Her golden artistry remained.I was deeply
saddened and wished I had somehow given her more protection...such as
covering her web with fine mesh (the type that one puts over fruit trees).
I reflected on how such a simple part of nature had provided not only
myself, but many others with such joy. Within such a short lifespan she had
encouraged so many people to "stop, reflect and respect" her beauty. I felt
privileged to have been able to share her with so many people, just "passing
by".
I short while ago, a bloke from S.A. called in to have a camel ride. I said
that I was not open at present for camel rides. He said.."oh I met some
people a few months back in Victoria who had visited you and they told me
the story about the Golden Spider across your driveway..they said that they
were so inspired by your love and protection of the spider that they had
changed their view totally about spiders being horrible and so forth!!!!"
.He said.." They even showed me a picture of her"....with this he opened his
car door, reached across for his wallet and pulled out a picture of "my
dearest Orb". I was so over whelmed I felt a little moisture run down my
cheeks. That little moment was worth a thousand lifetimes, and it took my
breath away. To think that her (my spider) memory had crossed not only
geographical boundaries and different socio-economic backgrounds, but
furthermore she was immortalized in Time...through "Memory."
I thanked him for calling and for sharing the contact. He asked if she was
still around, or if I could show him one. I said..."Like the seasons...they
come and go...Life is like that.."...I said...." they only stay with me for
such a short time..like a child I await their arrival with excitement and
wonder..."....
He shook my hand and as he drove off down my gravel driveway I thought..."I
have succeeded in the most important quest....I have been able to share and
to encourage a deeper understanding of the fragility and beauty of Life".
On 12/11/2006, Lynne Kelly posted:
I have had one of THOSE years - but have finally joined the real world
again and spent a few hours scanning the messages for the last few
months. There were so many topics I wanted to email about, but the
discussion was long finished.
I must respond to two - firstly I had to find Nisaba's email which
required such apology - and found an intriguing comment in it - the
word spider does seem to jump out at me:
Huntsmen are really amazing. I think it's because they are the only
spider I've yet met whose eye assemblage is large enough and detailed
enough to make direct eye contact. Other spiders (for instance,
funnel-webs and their ilk) have large enough eyes to see their eyes,
but with the huntsman, they have large enough eyes for you to see what
they're looking at and to make contact if they look at your eyes. They
personally give me the horrors, but I encourage them around the place
because, like chooks, they think of funnel-webs as chocolate ice cream
for spiders, and any enemy of an enemy is an -er- ally of mine.
The best spiders for looking at and talking to are the jumping
spiders. Much smaller than huntsmen, they are drop dead cute. If you
get one on your finger, or close somehow, you can see they have two
very large eyes on top of their heads (plus more smaller ones) and
they turn to follow you as you move. They can swivel on the joint
between their abdomens and cephalothorax. They are the biggest spider
family and common in houses and gardens. Just little.
"Oh ohh.." The spider froze, I didn't.
<smile> Don't blame me if word gets passed around and all the local
funnel-webs move in. Shall we start a spider thread on the list? I have
some excellent spider stories. Ask publicly if you want them.
Yes PLEASE! I am spending tomorrow at the Melbourne Museum with the
spider people, and have done the same in Perth. I was flown over for a
gifted education conference and managed to spend some time with the
spider people there. Fantastic! I still have some emails to this list
about spiders I want to get to. Be warned, though, I am collecting
spider stories for my next book, so I am hereby declaring a vested
interest.
Nisaba replied:
Huntsmen are really amazing. I think it's because they are the only
spider I've yet met whose eye assemblage is large enough and detailed
enough to make direct eye contact.
The best spiders for looking at and talking to are the jumping spiders.
Much smaller than huntsmen, they are drop dead cute. If you get one on
your finger, or close somehow, you can see they have two very large eyes
on top of their heads (plus more smaller ones) and they turn to follow you
as you move.
I'll have to keep a look-out.
They can swivel on the joint between their abdomens and cephalothorax.
Hey, BELLY-DANCING SPIDERS! I love it! <rolling around laughing>
Shall we start a spider thread on the list? I have
some excellent spider stories. Ask publicly if you want them.
Yes PLEASE! ... Be warned, though, I am collecting spider stories for my
next book, so I am hereby declaring a vested interest.
<grin> Spiders are on-topic, falling into a branch of science known as
zoology. Stick my name to my stories, and they're yours. And I wanna copy.
There was the daddy-long-legs who lived in my bathtub in the Showground road
house. I was a creature of regular habits, and the spider knew that when I
came into the bathroom at a certain time of night I'd fiddle about in front
of the mirror for a few minutes, then have a shower. There was always a
spider-web over the drain-hole, because the pipe was unconnected with the
sewerage, instead irrigating my backyard, so insects (and slugs) used it as
a point of egress, and every day the daddy-long-legs would cast a
catching-web over this fruitful source of income. And every evening when I
came in, I'd watch her climb up the sides of the bathtub laboriously to hang
from the ceiling until I'd had my shower, then let herself down and start to
rebuild even before I'd finished towelling myself off.
One night, I forget why, I broke my usual pattern, and came into the
bathroom and straight under the shower without any time-interval. The water
started, and just as it did I remembered her, and looked around just in time
to see a tangle of fine and completely broken legs go down the drain. I
killed a spider who knew my habits! I betrayed her! Deaded. But human life
and habits went on.
Two days later there was a slightly smaller daddy-long-legs in the bathtub,
checking out the remnants of damaged web hanging from the shower curtain
rail and around the place. I stopped and watched. The spider slowly and
carefully seemed to taste the web-fragments, passing it though its
mouth-pieces. This went on for a long time. The next day, I did my usual
evening stuff. The smaller spider had a catching-web over the drain. As
sopon as I came in, she climbed the wall. When I finshed showering, she came
down again and started spinning. So, can spiders detect information in
rudimentary form from pieces of web left behind by spiders of the same
species?
In the same house I had a companion living with me for a few years. One day
this companion was lying on their back on the bed, an arm flung upwards
against the wall, snoring their way through a day-sleep. It had been raining
for many days, and a few days earlier a huntsman had come inside out of the
rain, and had moved from room to room around the ceilings, looking
increasingly desperately for food. While my companion slept, the huntsman
was on the ceiling of the bedroom. I came to the door for something, and
stayed to watch.
The spider's whole attention was focussed on my companion's left hand. It
was a very *hungry* spider. It looked, and it thought small spidery
thoughts, which were obviously about whether it could take on prey the size
of the hand and get away with it. As I said, it was desperate. Twice it
started carefully down the wall, oblivious to me and to the rest of my
companion, and twice it thought the better of it and retreated to the
ceiling again. The third time it edged closer and closer to the hand,
obvioulsy planning an ambush-attack on the strange five-legged creature that
didn't seem to have noticed it.
Then my companion started in their sleep and twitched. You could *see* the
spider suddenly become aware that the hand was joined onto a whole, enormous
arm. The spider couldn't take on a creature that size - it ran up the wall
and stayed up the wall. I fell about laughing. The would-be meal woke up and
rather testily asked me why I was laughing. I explained the joke. I think I
also walked the spider outside on the end of a bit of paper or something. I
knew they don't like rain, but it was very close to starving indoors where
there was no prey - the desperation in thinking about taking on something
the size of a human hand was manifest. I hope it found a meal out in our wet
garden.
Then just recently, in another house, I was washing dishes one night. My
kitchen window is at the sink, and my veggie patch is just below, so the
whole area is rich in spiders who are my main biological defence against
plant-eating bugs. There was an orb-weaving spider hanging upside down, just
watching me, with curious or incurious eyes. She just hung there. She looked
quite intriguing, in that she was arranged not quite symmetrically, and this
interested me. I asked her to stay there just a little longer, finished the
dishes, drierd my hands pretty bloody quickly, and got the closest thing
possible to draw with, which happened to be a torn envelope and a biro. I
sketched her briefly so that when I later painted her, I'd have her exact
almost-symmetrical position modelled by the sketch. As soon as I had her
proportions and position down (in blue biro on an envelope - stylish art!),
I thanked her, And as soon as I thanked her, she clambered away on her web
into the darkness.
Brian LLoyd noted:
The best spiders for looking at and talking to are the jumping
spiders. Much smaller than huntsmen, they are drop dead cute.
I agree. I was playing with one yesterday. It was cold and he (she?)
was moving rather slowly so I let it warm up in my hand.
funnel-webs move in. Shall we start a spider thread on the list? I
have
some excellent spider stories. Ask publicly if you want them.
Yes PLEASE!
I am rather fond of tarantulas, wolf, and jumping spiders myself.
Tarantulas, at least the ones here, are gentle and inquisitive if
handled gently. In spite of numerous personal encounters I have never
been bitten.
OTOH, I am also fond of Preying Mantises.
and:
I am struck by how different we would view
this. Clearly we both would observe and endeavor to protect the spider.
(Observing and protecting spiders does not seem to be a popular quality
within the general public and I have been known to confront people
killing or planning to kill non-threatening spiders.) You do
anthropomorphize a bit more than I. ;-)
I happen to think that the Black Widow and Red Back (genus Latrodectus)
are quite pretty. Perhaps that characteristic of mine has something to do
with my general failure at marriage.
Nisaba added:
<grin> At least she didn't eat you for breakfast the morning after your
wedding.
Brian Lloyd answered:
No, my first two wives took several years to do that.
Mark Lightfoot commented:
G'day Brian
>I happen to think that the Black Widow and Red Back (genus
>Latrodectus) are quite pretty. Perhaps that characteristic of mine
>has something to do with my general failure at marriage.
This does not bode well for me.
At the age of 24 I have already lost two girlfriends for refusing to
kill spiders in the house (one incident involved me begging the young
lady not to squash a particularly large huntsman who I had named
Harold).
I personally believe a love of
spiders shows a tendency to use logic and reason in situations,
something that teenage girls lack <grin> :P.
Brian Lloyd replied:
Well, I never quite got around to naming them but I usually suggested
that the spider was not in the least interested in them as they were
not likely to be perceived as food. Somehow that just didn't carry
much water.
I personally believe a love of spiders shows a tendency to use
logic and
reason in situations, something that teenage girls lack <grin> :P.
Not if you find the right teen-aged girl. Unfortunately I am well
past the expiration date for my experience in that category so I
cannot advise. Sorry.
Lynne Kelly wrote:
Just what I need - an American resident with an interest in spiders! I
have been sorely puzzled by something.
In Eastern Australia we have a spider of which I am exceptionally fond
- which we call the black house spider. It is different to your house
spider.
http://www.amonline.net.au/factsheets/black_spider.htm
Why I am so fond of them is that there are heaps of them on our
windows, and everywhere else around a house, and can be readily
observed. Their behaviour is really interesting - they come out very
predictably, and never leave the web - unless it is a male in mating
season. They played a big role in my conversion arachnophobia to the
current obsession.
Is there an equivalent there? A spider which is readily found and can
be observed from the comfort of your own homes. I need one which is
likely to be resident, so an individual could be watched over the years.
I have been closely involved with four of them now over 8 years, and
each was distinctly different in their behaviour. David Attenborough,
when filming Life in the Undergrowth - was really surprised to observe
the variation in individual behaviour within a single species of
spider. He talked about it on Parkinson.
Is there an equivalent there?
And are your garden orb weavers easy to find?
and:
I happen to think that the Black Widow and Red Back (genus
Latrodectus) are quite pretty. Perhaps that characteristic of mine
has something to do with my general failure at marriage.
<grin> At least she didn't eat you for breakfast the morning after your
wedding.
I have been talking to a zoologist who specialises in pre-, during-
(is there a proper word?) and post-coital cannibalism in spiders. With
photos!
Pre-!!!!!!! I have the scientific papers to read, but if I understand
right, in some orb weavers - namely St Andrews Cross spiders, the male
organ continues to do it's task after the female has killed and eaten
the male. The dead remains are still attached - the male organ has
locking type shaping so it stays in place to complete it's ordained
task!
I have promised the arachnologists to point out that the males of some
species get away with no stress, some survive cannibalistic mates, and
some have neat ways to ensure it. Bondage is one! One spider binds the
female and does what he has to do before she gets herself free. I am
after an X rating on this book!
Brian Lloyd replied:
There is one very much like it nesting where I just put a digital
video camera in my back yard. I would have to look up its species.
Why I am so fond of them is that there are heaps of them on our
windows, and everywhere else around a house, and can be readily
observed. Their behaviour is really interesting - they come out
very predictably, and never leave the web - unless it is a male in
mating season. They played a big role in my conversion
arachnophobia to the current obsession.
Ah, good.
Is there an equivalent there? A spider which is readily found and
can be observed from the comfort of your own homes. I need one
which is likely to be resident, so an individual could be watched
over the years.
We have several which are pretty common. I most often see jumping
spiders and wolf spiders. Both hunt so are usually on the move. Wolf
spiders can get pretty big and some have been mistaken for a small
tarantula. It is not uncommon to find a female with her brood riding
on her back. She hunts and when she makes a kill, all the spiderlings
come down off her back to feed.
The common garden spider (marbled orb weaver) is, well, pretty common
too. Most obvious markings are a black abdomen with yellow patterned
mottling. She spins the quintessential regular "spider web" in the
bushes.
The Black Widow is also quite common. I suspect that if I look around
my hangar for a few minutes I will find one. I tend to let them stay
but that decision is sometimes overridden by a Higher Power.
We do have funnel-web spiders here but they are neither aggressive
nor dangerously venomous to humans. They look a lot like wolf spiders
but stay put in their cone-shaped sheet webs.
I have been closely involved with four of them now over 8 years,
and each was distinctly different in their behaviour. David
Attenborough, when filming Life in the Undergrowth - was really
surprised to observe the variation in individual behaviour within a
single species of spider. He talked about it on Parkinson.
Is there an equivalent there?
Hmm. The cycle here seems to be yearly and I haven't had any take up
permanent residence to see just how long they live. To be honest, I
couldn't say offhand.
And are your garden orb weavers easy to find?
Yes. I daresay there are two or three in the back yard of my new
house but I haven't looked for them yet. OTOH it is well into fall
and starting to get cold. Those that travel will be dropping in to
visit my warm house.
Let's see ... I often find crab spiders on the flowers. They tend to
blend in and await their prey arriving at the flowers. I do see
running crab spiders in the house pretty regularly. They are probably
the most common indoor arachnid.
The long-legged cellar spider (sometimes called the vibrating spider
as they will rapidly vibrate up and down if you gently disturb their
web) is what I seem to run into most often. The build their webs in
dark, undisturbed areas, areas I seem to frequent while pulling cable
and fixing things electrical. The young don't seem to move very far
away from mom so an area pretty quickly turns into a mass of tangled
webs. (Their webs are disorganized/unattractive and somewhat similar
to that of a black widow.) Because the feel is the same I tend to
quickly recoil if I inadvertently put my hand in one.
I occasionally come across a brown recluse, usually in the back of a
closet. Sorry, but I show them no mercy. They are just too dangerous.
Perhaps the most interesting arachnid I come across is the Solphugid
or sun spider. It is not a spider per se but looks like a cross
between a spider and a scorpion. They have a relatively short life
cycle and I usually only see them a couple of weeks out of the year.
They are amazingly aggressive and will literally chase you around the
room. I have heard that the bite is quite painful so I have avoided
learning first-hand.
Enough for now. I have a router to configure.
Kevin Phyland added:
I declare my hand now...I am a tad arachnophobic (ok...a LOT)...but because I am I tend to be very aware of the beasts.
The ones we have here are most commonly:
* black house spiders
* wolf spiders
* huntsmen
* trapdoors
* redbacks
Of all this plethora of beasts
only the trappie and the huntie really frighten me...the trappie
because they are awesomely bitey...(enormous fangs)...and the huntie
because they are just plain big! (oh yeah...and I once got bitten on
the big toe by a trappie in the dark...and I kid you not...it hurt!)
At school there was an amazing orb-weaver tho...I found this out late one night by stumbling into the web...now...talk
about strength of materials...it felt like wire!
I freaked...I ran around in ever increasing circles trying to get the imagined spider off my carcass...
Australia...the home of the spider and the snake.
Peter Adderley posted:
I don't have warm and fuzzy feelings for funnelweb spiders, although I
can admire a huntsman at a safe distance:
1. In the 1960s our next door neighbour built a swimming pool out of
sandstone.
It was a pretty rough old job but it entertained all the local kids for
years.
Only problem was that before we jumped in and stirred the murky water,
someone was "volunteered" to dredge the sump for "flangelbeeps", as we
called them.
Every week or so a large spider was redeemed with some legs rotted away
and covered with slime. They were usually well dead until one day we
placed a spider in this condition of the side of the pool. 15 minutes
later we watched it crawl away into the bushes.
2. One summer night I was reading a book, whilst sitting on my bed, back
leaning against an open window. I was wearing a thin shirt.
I felt something on my shoulder, and when I looked down a rather meaty
funnelweb was crawling across my chest. Somehow I managed to flick it to
the floor before it became excited, and I panted in shock for a good
hour after that.
3. There's not many things which impart a state of fear than when:
a. Whist driving through a crowded shopping centre with an ungainly
salad roll in one hand, steering and gearchainging with the other, when
you pull down the sun visor to meet a truly enormous huntsman six inches
from your nose or..
b. As you climb into you car on a dark night, when the interior light
doesn't work, and you feel the soft caress of spider web across your face.
I'm sure I've published this site before and more than once, but here is
my backyard zoo:
http://www.acay.com.au/~adderley/pterazoo/
The funnelweb fangs are pretty cute. The huntsman was sunning
him/herself on a concrete letterbox.
Nisaba Merrieweather responded:
Any distance is a safe distance. they only try to eat your hand when you're
asleep and they're starving.
Although, for your own peace of mind, NEVER MAKE EYE CONTACT! It will haunt
you forever - spider-thoughts are a bit different to human-thoughts.
Gerald Cairns added:
We have usually two or three large huntsmen in the house at any one
time and we get on just fine respecting each other's spaces. The only
time they breach the rule is occasionally they will walk across our
faces when we are asleep in bed. They do this very gently with a very
soft touch and we have learned not to swat them in the dark after the
first one got walloped into spider heaven one night. They can be coaxed
on to a hand and taken outside when guests insist, really quite
inoffensive. Swatting blindly something you can't see just could have
unfortunate repercussions.
Sleep well!
Brian Lloyd replied:
I was stringing more wires and kit about the house yesterday and
today. I pulled back a bit of wall sheeting to find that the little
sweet-eating ants had built their nest in insulation. I came across
the brood chamber. They packed up and left by the next day.
I found one funnel-web spider had nested near the camera I put up in
the back yard. I had to run some cat-5 cable through the web of a
vibrating spider. Evidently her egg sack had recently hatched as she
had about a hundred spiderlings in her web with her. I ran across
several juvenile orb weavers in a corner.
Next time I will bring the camera with me to get some pictures.
Gerald Cairns commented:
I find most of the interesting events one wants to record tend to happen when the camera is elsewhere.
Peter Macinnis wrote:
Brian, I have packed the spider books, but I am fairly sure that what
you mean by a funnelweb is NOT what we mean, and that what we mean is
far meaner than the mean. I think you have a few mygalomorphs in the
US&A, but we are talking fam. Hexathelidae: subfamily Atracinae here.
That is Atrax and Hadronyche spp.
These spiders have a venom that is bad news for primates. VERY bad news.
Note that by "fairly sure", I state a firm belief that cannot be readily
verified by me.
Kevin Phyland replied:
Atrax robustus we don't have here...but I'm open to debate on whether
the mouse spider doesn't co-exist with it...and that the naughty
funnel-web may get as much bad press as the white-tailed spider...
Yes...as far as I know...the Sydney funnel-web is probably the most (I hate this....I can never remember whether
*poisonous* or
*venomous*
is the right word...) deadly spider in Australia (maybe even the
world...although some show I watched on Nat. Geo. channel had another
culprit - somewhere in So. America)
Anyhoo...any clarification would be appreciated..
P.S. But as far as spiders that have actually NIPPED me...the trapdoor takes the cake...
Nisaba Merrieweather wrote:
If it is, and they've gone feral on another continent where nobody knows
about htem...
well, we always knew America was overpopulated.
What a great terrortist attack - harvesting a lot of funnelwebs from the
Eastern seaboard and smuggling them over!
..., but we are talking fam. Hexathelidae: subfamily Atracinae here. That
is _Atrax_ and _Hadronyche_ spp.
These spiders have a venom that is bad news for primates. VERY bad news.
you forgot to mention that they also have a personality disorder.
I know from living experience that most spiders will back away rather htan
bite - they will only bite if their eggs are threatened or if they in their
very small spidery minds think you have blocked their escape hatch.
Funnelwebs are different. They tend to bite first and not bother asking
questions later, especially the males who are as gung-ho as anyone else in
possession of more than their share of testosterone. Unfortunately, they
also have more than their fair share orf venom. A male funnel web will
deliver enough venom in a decent bite to kill a human in indifferent health
in around two hours without treatment. Until I got chooks and when I still
had a vehicle, I used to dig the bastards out regularly and give them to the
antivenine programme.
Anna Morton observed:
Intriguing - I recently read a (fiction) book where a radical group
in the US used blue-ringed octopus to kill, or at least incapacitate
severely, a few people they wanted to do away with. The people
affected didn't know what had happened to them, so they couldn't tell
the doctors if they ended up in hospital rather than dead. Perhaps
unfortunately for the radicals, more than one of their victims ended
up at the same hospital, which clued the doctors that something very
strange was going on, and they figured it out. But until then, they
wouldn't have suspected a little octopus from Oz.
Peter Macinnis responded:
Poorly-researched fiction. The active venom, TTX or tetrodotoxin, is
found in many animals. See http://www.chm.bris.ac.uk/motm/ttx/ttx.htm
From that, you will learn that bacteria are now considered to be the
real source. Now if somebody came up with a GM beer yeast that produced
TTX, you might have a story -- except that no brewer uses GM yeasts for
fear of uninformed adverse reactions, and they care for their yeast
cultures rather jealously.
Brian Lloyd replied:
You are 100% correct, something I pointed out in what was my first
posting on this topic. The ones I am talking about are of the family
Agelenidae. I find it interesting that they call them funnel-web
spiders here. They are almost indistinguishable from small wolf
spiders and are quite timid. Still, they call them funnel-web spiders
here so that what I call them too, no doubt powerfully confusing to
those of you with the more interesting variety.
Here is a good site. Scroll down to find "funnel web weaver". That is
what I was talking about. Just below that are some good pix of wolf
spiders, some carrying their spiderlings. Note the similarity.
http://www.cirrusimage.com/spider.htm
You should check into the Brown Recluse we have here.
http://bugguide.net/node/view/33493
The nasty thing about the Brown Recluse is that the venom is
necrotic. As far as I know, all they can do is just keep cleaning the
every-growing wound. People have lost limbs from the necrosis caused
by Brown Recluse venom. I am unaware of any antivenin.
Peter Macinnis answered:
Sorry -- missed that. I was mainly aware that in this predominantly Oz
list, we have a clear pic of funnelwebs, even those who don't know an
araneomorph from a mygalomorph. Of course, that was why that bloke
Linnaeus invented that Latin stuff, innit?
So my motivation was to clarify -- that and no more.
Thanks for bugguide -- that is an excellent site! It isn't so easy for
keying down a specimen, though . . . and limited to US examples, so our
funnelwebs are missing. Let's hope they add to it later. Meanwhile, I
will purloin that for the next build of
http://members.ozemail.com.au/~macinnis/scifun/resource.htm
and:
I have seen assertions, of dubious validity, that it was actually a
bacterium that caused the necrosis, though I seem to recall a more
recent claim that there had been a wholesale gene transfer (one way or
the other) between a bacterium and the spider. The details elude me.
Ah, here we go: http://technocrat.net/d/2006/2/2/156
From that, enthusiasts can search further, having the names.
Brian Lloyd answered:
So my motivation was to clarify -- that and no more.
Right. I was aware of the difference AND the similarity of name. I
wasn't being critical; I was just trying to be clear.
Thanks for bugguide -- that is an excellent site! It isn't so easy
for keying down a specimen, though . . . and limited to US
examples, so our funnelwebs are missing. Let's hope they add to it
later. Meanwhile, I will purloin that for the next build of http://
members.ozemail.com.au/~macinnis/scifun/resource.htm
Oh, since I am aware that, not being in Oz I am in the minority, I
wanted to present a source that was more limited to what we have over
here. Oz is just different and what you consider commonplace is not,
at least not for us. I thought that the converse might also be true
so I posted that to ensure that we were using the same pictures in
our heads even when the words got in the way.
and:
Well, the key point to the bitten person is that, if bitten, they
have a significant chance that this necrotic process to take its
course. It happens with the Brown Recluse bite and not from the bite
of other spiders.
Lynne Kelly posted:
Brian, this is a terrific help. Just what I needed.
There is one very much like it nesting where I just put a digital video
camera in my back yard. I would have to look up its species.
I would really appreciate knowing what it is. Or even enough guideline
to look it up. I have a solid book on American spiders.
We have several which are pretty common. I most often see jumping
spiders and wolf spiders. Both hunt so are usually on the move. Wolf
spiders can get pretty big and some have been mistaken for a small
tarantula. It is not uncommon to find a female with her brood riding on
her back. She hunts and when she makes a kill, all the spiderlings come
down off her back to feed.
Great. Both those families will get a really good covering. There is
enough overlap in behaviour between species to use what I have
observed here and draw it out for a global approach.
This is all to do with the 'treatment' for arachnophobia being based
on observing and getting to understand the spiders around the home.
The common garden spider (marbled orb weaver) is, well, pretty common
too. Most obvious markings are a black abdomen with yellow patterned
mottling. She spins the quintessential regular "spider web" in the
bushes.
This is terrific. I knew they were global - same family, possibly same
genus as the ones I see here. The first time I watched one spin her
web from start to finish was the final nail in the arachnophobic
coffin, straight to obsession in 45 minutes. It was a very powerful
experience for a recovering arachnophobic.
The Black Widow is also quite common. I suspect that if I look around
my hangar for a few minutes I will find one. I tend to let them stay
but that decision is sometimes overridden by a Higher Power.
Good. We have the red-back, but there seems to be someone in the
Lactrodectus genus almost everywhere, with similar looks and biology.
We do have funnel-web spiders here but they are neither aggressive nor
dangerously venomous to humans. They look a lot like wolf spiders but
stay put in their cone-shaped sheet webs.
Thank you for alerting me to this. I didn't realise that what you call
a funnel-web is nothing like what we call a funnel-web. Basically,
ours are primitives (Mygalomorphs) and yours are moderns
(Araneomorphs). This will be very important to bring out and this
might be a really good example to use to explain the difference.
Let's see ... I often find crab spiders on the flowers. They tend to
blend in and await their prey arriving at the flowers. I do see running
crab spiders in the house pretty regularly. They are probably the most
common indoor arachnid.
Really? I have never see one indoors and not often in flowers, but
mostly because they are so well camouflaged. Is that a cold weather
thing? Indoors, the huntsmen, wolf spiders, jumpers, white tailed,
grey house, black house, daddy-long legs ... are all common in houses,
but not crab/flower spiders.
That is a significant difference. This is gold for me!
The long-legged cellar spider (sometimes called the vibrating spider as
I had to check what this is. I think it's what we call a daddy-long
legs. Mind you, we call a few different things that, often including
harvestmen.
I occasionally come across a brown recluse, usually in the back of a
closet. Sorry, but I show them no mercy. They are just too dangerous.
No need to say sorry on that one. The bite sounds horrific.
Perhaps the most interesting arachnid I come across is the Solphugid or
sun spider. It is not a spider per se but looks like a cross between a
spider and a scorpion. They have a relatively short life cycle and I
usually only see them a couple of weeks out of the year. They are
amazingly aggressive and will literally chase you around the room. I
have heard that the bite is quite painful so I have avoided learning
first-hand.
I have heard of them, but hadn't considered them for the book, but I will now.
Enough for now. I have a router to configure. :-)
In my family, we consider that a black art. And they are all IT
experts! I do like talking to people who dabble in the black arts.
I am sorry about the delay in thanking you for this sensational stuff.
It is much appreciated. I did a gifted education conference a few
weeks ago and have been inundated in interest in my work, so have had
to deal with that. It is great for that side of my life, but rather
got in the way of spiders.
Thank you heaps, Brian. Any further comments would be greatly appreciated.
Mac Lau wrote:
Can't help it. Have to relay an experience. Woke up one night hearing
drums. Switched on the light and put my finger into my ears to clear
it, thinking it could be blocked or something. Withdrew my finger to
see a little leg broken off something. Rushed to the bathroom and
filled ear with de-waxing liquid. Out came 15mm of the most ulgy
looking, white-spot spider with one leg missing.
Now I have a fear of going to bed.
How do I prevent this from happening again???
Morris Grey replied:
Thanks for that just I was going to bed.
Do what I am going to do, never sleep again!
Rhonda Cetta-Hoyle responded:
this won't stop the spiders from entering the house but at the pool
each morning, people use Blu-tack as ear plugs as it moulds nicely, may
be to regain your confidence you could use this for a little while.
Lynne Kelly answered:
You think about the statistics. How long did it take to happen the
first time? You probably have that long again until the second. That
is a totally unresearched theory!
I have the most delightful spider-in-ear story from one of our top
arachnologists, now in Perth. They collect great arachnologists over
there. Mark Harvey told about the time he had the same thing -
deafening drumming on his ear drum. He knew it was something live in
there. His partner is an expert on ants. She told him to wait. If it
is an ant, it will come out again of its own accord - they don't seek
enclosed places other than their nests. He waited. It didn't. So they
tried the ear wax, water - all to no avail. He went to the hospital
urgently, they got it out, he started at it and announced it was a
????? ?????. (I haven't go the full story from him - so I just spoilt
the punch line!). The doctor isn't used to people giving the exact
species of invertebrates extracted from ears.
Mark is our top taxonomist!
Writing this book is bliss! Thank you for reminding me I must do
spiders-in-ears. I must email Mark to get the story in his words.
Peter Macinnis suggested:
Sleep with your fingers in your ears?
and:
Not to mention the urban myth of the redbacks in the dreadlocks. I
think you said you are not doing mites, which is a pity, given the
little chaps that live in the sebaceous glands on our foreheads.
David recomended:
For those who are really worried about otic arachnids, why not have a spider
wasp ( Cryptocheilus bicolor ) as a symbiotic "pet" who could guard your
precious earholes from attack.
Why not use a totally natural solution rather than some nasty chemical?
Lynne Kelly wrote:
All spider eating wasps should be destroyed. As should all spider
eating birds. (That is a family battle - husband is a fanatic birder.
:-)
There is one wasp - I will get the species name right from the
arachnologist who was telling me - who lines a mud nest with a range
of spiders from very soft bodied, to less so, in order for the larvae
to work through. Pretty smart, eh?
I assume it is one of the dauber wasps, who are all pretty keen on
stacking their mud nests with wasps.
I was out photographing today, macro lens primed, and got the most
wonderful bee photo. There will not be enough years to study all these
minibeasts properly. There are some stunning insect books out for
'kids'. The diversity is astounding.
Toby Fiander replied:
I am sorry to bust in here and destroy all these totally natural solutions
to a problem that may or may not exist, but I find fly screens and draft
preventers are reasonably effect at keeping out unwanted insects and
spiders.
After that, keeping a dutiful husband is probably a reasonable strategy.
Jann can provide further detail if required....
Lynne Kelly answered:
This ear stuff is spooking me out.
I usually wax lyrical about spiders, but it is suddenly taking on a
different meaning!
Cockroaches are an animal I have never taken to. We used to have them
a lot at a previous house, and when I went to the toilet at night and
turned on the light, one would sometimes run for dark under my bare
feet. Turned me off them completely.
Let's face it - they're not gorgeous like spiders!
and:
Thank you so much for posting this again. I certainly missed it. It is
wonderful. I am absolutely sure they are well aware of your presence.
I was photographing a jumping spider today who was watching me and
moving around the stem to get away from my camera.
I am also convinced that this awareness contributes to arachnophobia
and will be saying so in the book. Other invertebrates just don't
watch you and respond like spiders do. But that is also one of their
attractions - they are communicating.
Yours is a really lovely observation story, Julia, and so like my
relationship with a garden orb weaver who was instrumental in my
conversion to arachnophilia. I feel the same sense of loss when she
died. Thank you.
Brian Lloyd noted:
Lynne Kelly wrote:
I have been far more than a tad arachnophobic, and the subtitle of the
book, assuming they don't change it, is 'from arachnophobia to
obsession - my story and my goal in life - my missionary zeal is
devoted to converting the entire world's population to archnophiles.
The ones we have here are most commonly:
* black house spiders
* wolf spiders
* huntsmen
* trapdoors
* redbacks
Matches here. These are all key families to cover. There are 108 or so
families, so I can't do them all. With 40,000 species, I am going to
have to be selective!
Brian, do you have trap doors much in CA? At all?
At school there was an amazing orb-weaver tho...I found this
out late one night by stumbling into the web...now...talk
about strength of materials...it felt like wire!
The physics, and chemistry, of spider silk is amazing stuff.
Unbelievably strong for almost zero weight.
I understand that it doesn't really scale tho'. Gun sight reticles
used to use spider webbing for markings as no one could make
something that fine that would hold up.
and:
The long-legged cellar spider (sometimes called the vibrating
spider as
I had to check what this is. I think it's what we call a daddy-long
legs. Mind you, we call a few different things that, often
including harvestmen.
I believe they are very different although somewhat similar in
appearance. Their behavior is totally different. What I call a daddy-
long-legs is actually the Huntsman. It has what appears to be an
oblate spheroid body and very long, fine legs. It actively hunts and
one can see it wandering about, usually near the base of a house
foundation. The vibrating spider spins a chaotic web in dark places
and then sits in it. Its body is more cylindrical and very obviously
two-part. But the characteristics of the legs cause people to mistake
the two.
I occasionally come across a brown recluse, usually in the back of a
closet. Sorry, but I show them no mercy. They are just too dangerous.
No need to say sorry on that one. The bite sounds horrific.
After poking about for more information on this one I find that the
bite that is often attributed to the Brown Recluse is also
characteristic of the Hobo spider.
Perhaps the most interesting arachnid I come across is the
Solphugid or
sun spider. It is not a spider per se but looks like a cross
between a
spider and a scorpion. They have a relatively short life cycle and I
usually only see them a couple of weeks out of the year. They are
amazingly aggressive and will literally chase you around the room. I
have heard that the bite is quite painful so I have avoided learning
first-hand.
I have heard of them, but hadn't considered them for the book, but
I will now.
They are interesting to watch.
Enough for now. I have a router to configure. :-)
In my family, we consider that a black art. And they are all IT
experts! I do like talking to people who dabble in the black arts.
I designed the first dial-up router that made use of the public
switched telephone network to establish dynamic connections. Later it
became the remote access server and allowed people to dial-in and
connect to the Internet. Seems I have an aptitude for this kind of
art. Mostly it seems to be an affinity for deducing all the ways that
these things can stop working. The trick seems to have something to
do with being able to switch my point of view on the fly, kind of
like looking at that classical image and seeing the two faces and the
candlestick at the same time.
I am sorry about the delay in thanking you for this sensational
stuff. It is much appreciated. I did a gifted education conference
a few weeks ago and have been inundated in interest in my work, so
have had to deal with that. It is great for that side of my life,
but rather got in the way of spiders.
No worries. One really good thing about this medium is that you can
pick up the thread of a conversation months or even years later.
and:
All spider eating wasps should be destroyed. As should all spider
eating birds. (That is a family battle - husband is a fanatic
birder. :-)
Well, it seems to me that there is a balance and that what is should be.
Ray Stephens commented:
Spiders tickle.
..and so long as that is the extent of our most direct and infrequently
immediate relationship, spiders and I, then I can live with that
and I'm sure they'd prefer the fight by reflexive flick to the
squish on site too.
Lynne Kelly replied:
All spider eating wasps should be destroyed. As should all spider
eating birds. (That is a family battle - husband is a fanatic
birder. :-)
Well, it seems to me that there is a balance and that what is should be.
Agreed - I was joking. Being overrun by spiders would be a tad horrible.
But I did just read about places in Europe where they cultivate spider
populations in farming areas as a natural pest control. There are
places in China where they build little huts out of straw next to
paddy fields to house the hibernating spiders. A guy in America allows
a weed strip around all fields for wolf spiders to breed and finds
this reduces the pests in the crop. They eat leafhoppers and 20
spiders per square metre, approx, will reduce pest numbers by up to
90%. In Britain, they use money spiders in wheat fields to eat aphids.
This is in Paul Hillyard's great book: "The Book of the Spider". I can
feel a science fiction novel growing in my head!
He says 99% mortality rate among insects is normal. If natural
predators are around. Insecticides kill spiders as well as insects.
They don't count legs.
Has anyone heard of anything like that here?
I want to build little spider huts!
Has anyone here kept a spider? I have a black house who has been in
the house for about 6months now. She is likely to lay soon, and I
really don't want the inside of the house to end up like the outside,
which is covered in their webs. natural predators on spiders,like
birds and wasps, don't tend to be inside. Although white-tailed
spiders do. I watched one for a day or so as it lived neatly in a
black-house spider tunnel, and later found out that is common -
white-tailed prey on black-house.
I would like to collect my black-house female and put her in a
container, let her weave and then leave the lid off the jar so she can
collect her dinner in the normal manner. Alan Henderson, who does the
minibeasts at the Melbourne Museum, suggested it. Once she has woven
her web, she won't move from it. It would be very good to take to
schools when I do spiders, because she would be so contained and safe
and non-scary.
Any suggestions welcome!
and:
I again thank you for alerting me to the US versions.
I believe they are very different although somewhat similar in
appearance. Their behavior is totally different. What I call a
daddy-long-legs is actually the Huntsman.
It has what appears to be an
oblate spheroid body and very long, fine legs. It actively hunts and
one can see it wandering about, usually near the base of a house
foundation. The vibrating spider spins a chaotic web in dark places and
then sits in it. Its body is more cylindrical and very obviously
two-part. But the characteristics of the legs cause people to mistake
the two.
So now I am confused about what spider you are referring to around the
base of house foundations. Our huntsman would usually be high on the
walls. But it sounds like you are talking about something with very
long legs like a daddy-long-legs.
After poking about for more information on this one I find that the
bite that is often attributed to the Brown Recluse is also
characteristic of the Hobo spider.
I must get both of those clear. They get talked about a lot.
I will try and work out what our equivalent is - if there is one. I am
trying to match ecological niches for the way I want to write the
book, but although the arachnologists I am talking to agree that is
logical, they are not sure what fills the niche of our black-house
elsewhere. It is certainly the most common spider around here. Well,
the most observable - because of the hundreds of webs everywhere.
Perhaps the most interesting arachnid I come across is the Solphugid or
They are interesting to watch.
I started to read about them. Amazing! I love the Internet hoax which
went around:
http://www.snopes.com/photos/bugs/camelspider.asp
I am also writing online extension units for schools, and one is on
science in the media. I did an analysis of a big cat report here in
Victoria which was the result of a (deliberate in my mind) optical
illusion photo. So I was using that in one of the tasks. I have now
added this camel spider and the other one I know from writing Crocodile:
http://www.snopes.com/photos/animals/wcgator.asp
So now the task for the kids gives three examples of exaggerated
critter stories based on trick photography. I can weave a good science
task around that. So thank you for drawing my attention to camel
spiders.
I must admit, yesterday I was photographing a jumping spider and
really getting high on how beautiful she was. Camel spiders don't do
that for me!
In my family, we consider that a black art. And they are all IT
experts! I do like talking to people who dabble in the black arts.
I designed the first dial-up router that made use of the public
switched telephone network to establish dynamic connections.
WOW! When and where?
The trick seems to have something to do with
being able to switch my point of view on the fly, kind of like looking
at that classical image and seeing the two faces and the candlestick at
the same time.
The stuff I enjoy reading most are things which trigger that reaction
in my head. I love suddenly seeing something differently.
Gerald Cairns demurred:
I have to take issue with you on the point that "Other invertebrates
just don't watch you and respond like spiders do"! I have photographed
lots of insects and many of them do watch you very closely and often
move to the opposite side of the plant stem as you try to focus on
them. You should try photographing South African Citrus Thrips now that
is a challenge.
and:
As an absolute statement it is true that insecticides kill spiders but
they tend to be naturally highly resistant compared to other
invertebrates and very difficult to successfully control this way. I am
not advocating the use of insecticides, I don't believe that killing
with sprays etc. is a good strategy, indeed I think it is largely
counterproductive creating more problems than it solves in most cases.
I used to facetiously say of Qld when we first moved here that the
State was noted for its spiders, cockroaches and the National Party,
order does not imply any value judgement.
Otherwise I agree with your generalisations.
Lynne Kelly replied:
As an absolute statement it is true that insecticides kill spiders but they
tend to be naturally highly resistant compared to other invertebrates and
very difficult to successfully control this way.
I have had that said in anecdotes, and meant to follow up. Do you have
any references on that? I have contacts in the field (literally) who I
can confirm with, but if you have a reference I would appreciate it.
Hillyard refers to the problem with insecticides on farms killing
spiders. He comes out of the British museum - could British and
European spiders be wimps compared to ours?
I used to facetiously say of Qld when we first moved here that the State
was noted for its spiders, cockroaches and the National Party, order does
not imply any value judgement.
Lovely!
Thanks for saying this, Gerald. Much appreciated.
Mac Lau posted:
Sleep well and rest assured. The chances of a spider in the ear must be
worst than winning Tattslotto. But then again look at the number of
people buying Tattslotto ?
Well at least it has only happen to me once. Maybe I should feel lucky and run out and buy a Tattslotto ticket.
Thanks for the advice of wearing swimming ear plugs. Tried it and just couldn't sleep. Not used to it, I suppose.
Has anyone else out heard of spider in the ear ? Maybe I could be in the Guiness Book of record. WOW
Gerald Cairns wrote:
First
hand experience only. In days gone by when we had our farm houses
sprayed for spiders where they were a big problem simply in numbers and
taking over with their webs we found the professional treatments to be
virtually ineffective. Of course since then my views have changed and
now we encourage the birds around and the Willy Wagtails especially
love spiders. Thus we now have a nice balance between an acceptable
resident population of spiders and bird shit. :-) The house geckos seem to help keep the smaller spiders in check. So now we don't have any need for sprays and
are unfortunate if we use 1 can of fly spray per annum.
I have confirmed this experience
by also applying the sprays myself and regardless of concentration the
results are consistent - surface sprays are virtually useless and
direct contact little better unless you physically drown them. The
Daddy Long Legs sorry forgot the species, are still something of a
nuisance and the only solution for them is a periodic vacuum cleaning.
We once had a cat that used to love eating these spiders so I presume
they must have tasted good to her, but I'd rather not have a cat too
many other issues to deal with.
and:
I do agree with you on the
intensity spiders can show in observing humans but am unable to
quantify the relativity between the insects etc. Certainly the jumping
spiders are real characters but similarly we have a small red ant here
of which there are several caste sizes in a colony reminiscent of fire
ants but they are not fire ants, and these ants have very acute
distance sight and monumental jumping capacities. The ants are not in
the least aggressive and trying to catch one requires a certain
gymnastic skill which I am rapidly losing with age. These ants often
seem to go out in small "raiding" parties and the smaller members can
be seen jumping instead of running to keep up with the pack. A finger
placed on front causes immediate side stepping by jumping before they
continue their trek to where ever - they have been too fast and
difficult to follow so I haven't been able to see what the purpose of
these parties really is. These ants easily equal the capacities of the
small jumping spiders in visual acuity and jumping capacity.
I notice the little jumping
spiders have no trouble sitting (standing) on very hot concrete and
picking off the small black ants that abound here. One would have
thought heat sufficient to fry them, certainly would do an egg.
Nisaba Merrieweather cackled:
This ear stuff is spooking me out. I usually wax lyrical about spiders, but
it is suddenly taking on a different meaning!
I like a punnishing schedule myself.
Cockroaches ....Let's face it - they're not gorgeous like spiders!
Indeed. Their mouth-parts are not as enchanting, and they don't weave.
I think perhaps only a trapdoor, funnelweb or some other kind of burrowing
spider would be interested in ears, perhaps mistaking them for ready-made
burrows.
And they'd have to be unusually small trapdoors and funnelwebs. I don't mind
the odd trapdoor, and I wouldn't mind funnelwebs if they didn't have such a
personality problem. When I was a kid everyone used to sagely believe I'd
grow into another Alan Seale (today's equivalent is Peter Cundell), because
I maintained a row of healthy plants on my bedroom window-sill. Little did
they know, they were just there as organic housing for the four or five
species of spiders who lived and bred there right through my teens <sinister
laugh>.
Brian Lloyd wrote:
I again thank you for alerting me to the US versions.
I believe they are very different although somewhat similar in
appearance. Their behavior is totally different. What I call a
daddy-long-legs is actually the Huntsman.
It has what appears to be an
oblate spheroid body and very long, fine legs. It actively hunts and
one can see it wandering about, usually near the base of a house
foundation. The vibrating spider spins a chaotic web in dark
places and
then sits in it. Its body is more cylindrical and very obviously
two-part. But the characteristics of the legs cause people to mistake
the two.
So now I am confused about what spider you are referring to around
the base of house foundations. Our huntsman would usually be high
on the walls. But it sounds like you are talking about something
with very long legs like a daddy-long-legs.
Yes. I made a mistake and confused the name. I was describing the
harvestman, not the huntsman.
bite that is often attributed to the Brown Recluse is also
characteristic of the Hobo spider.
After poking about for more information on this one I find that the
I must get both of those clear. They get talked about a lot.
It appears that there are also Hobo spiders in Europe but their bite
is not particularly toxic. It is only after they got to the pacific
northwest (Seattle, Washington, USA) that somehow their bite became
such a threat. It would be quite interesting to discover how that
happened.
I will try and work out what our equivalent is - if there is one. I
am trying to match ecological niches for the way I want to write
the book, but although the arachnologists I am talking to agree
that is logical, they are not sure what fills the niche of our
black-house elsewhere. It is certainly the most common spider
around here. Well, the most observable - because of the hundreds of
webs everywhere.
Perhaps the most interesting arachnid I come across is the
Solphugid or
They are interesting to watch.
I started to read about them. Amazing! I love the Internet hoax
which went around:
http://www.snopes.com/photos/bugs/camelspider.asp
Wow! What will people think up next! They do look like lobsters in
that picture. The ones I see around here are rarely more than about
2cm long.
I am also writing online extension units for schools, and one is on
science in the media. I did an analysis of a big cat report here in
Victoria which was the result of a (deliberate in my mind) optical
illusion photo. So I was using that in one of the tasks. I have now
added this camel spider and the other one I know from writing
Crocodile:
http://www.snopes.com/photos/animals/wcgator.asp
So now the task for the kids gives three examples of exaggerated
critter stories based on trick photography. I can weave a good
science task around that. So thank you for drawing my attention to
camel spiders.
You are welcome. :-) Mostly what I find myself doing with Internet
research is trying to explain that a lot of what is on the internet
is not correct and they need to apply critical reasoning to try to
weed out the worst of the information.
I must admit, yesterday I was photographing a jumping spider and
really getting high on how beautiful she was. Camel spiders don't
do that for me!
No, they are just, uh, unattractive. But they are pretty cool looking
too. They make me think of something out of a SciFi movie.
In my family, we consider that a black art. And they are all IT
experts! I do like talking to people who dabble in the black arts.
I designed the first dial-up router that made use of the public
switched telephone network to establish dynamic connections.
WOW! When and where?
Silicon Valley, Telebit Corporation, 1989-1991. It was called the
NetBlazer. Also out of that activity came the Point-to-Point protocol
(PPP).
The trick seems to have something to do with
being able to switch my point of view on the fly, kind of like
looking
at that classical image and seeing the two faces and the
candlestick at
the same time.
The stuff I enjoy reading most are things which trigger that
reaction in my head. I love suddenly seeing something differently.
Sometimes a good SF story will strike me that way.
and:
Hi Lynne,
I have to take issue with you on the point that "Other
invertebrates just
don't
watch you and respond like spiders do"!
You can almost have a conversation with a Preying Mantis.
I have photographed lots of insects
and many of them do watch you very closely and often move to the
opposite
side of the plant stem as you try to focus on them.
Good point. I tend to do the same thing when strange people thrust a
camera in my face.
Lynne Kelly replied:
It appears that there are also Hobo spiders in Europe but their bite is
not particularly toxic. It is only after they got to the pacific
northwest (Seattle, Washington, USA) that somehow their bite became
such a threat. It would be quite interesting to discover how that
happened.
Good question. I shall see what I can find out. I'll let you know if I
do. Don't hold your breath. The list of things I want to know is huge!
and:
> You have a blissful marriage, yes?
Yes. Despite this. actually we are highly compatible. We go out with
digital cameras - him looking skywards and me looking otherwise. We
share a love of natural history,just with different biases. I actually
love bird watching as well, just not with the same fanaticism. He
finds all animals interesting, but the uncuddlies I like don't top his
list.
Now if he was really into racing cars or living in a sterile concreted
'garden', then there would be trouble.
and:
You are right and have now convinced me that other invertebrates
respond. I had forgotten about praying mantis - they most certainly
do. I photographed one the other day. Stunning critters - and people
aren't frightened of them. And the ant story is also convincing.
OK, there's more to it.
My intention is now to ask everyone I meet what it is about spiders
that worries them and see if I can get a pattern.
and:
Now if he was really into racing cars or living in a sterile
concreted 'garden', then there would be trouble.
I think you'll find that arachnids can and have colonised both of those
quite successfully.
<grin>
Nisaba
True - they can colonise almost anywhere on the planet. But I actually
want my world filled with a tad more nature than spider infested
concrete.
We live on 18 acres with kangaroos, wallabies, echidna, wombats, 70+
species of birds, 4 of possums and god knows how many spiders ... all
breeding. And veggie gardens and an orchard and it goes on. Life is
never dull. Just wish it would rain a bit more. We tried living in the
city, but found the bush around was essential for us.
Niels Petersen added:
In Tasmania the house was full of daddy long legs. Kept all the other
spiders out.
In Queensland huntsmen can be found at ground level as well as occasionally
coming inside.
No other spiders inside but that may be because of the dozen or so Geckos
who come inside on a regular basis through the louvres above the sliding
doors. They inhabit differing sections of the the 8ft covered patio that
extends right around the house.
Hand feeding magpies and a few bush turkeys that inhabit the river bank at
the rear of the house is a daily occurence. About a dozen magpies, heaps
of pigeons, wrens and finches a regular visitors to the house and garden. I
think the wildlife must lower the outside spider population to some extent.
A pair of Kingfishers have been feeding for the last 4 weeks off 3/4 inch
white grubs that are in great abundance on the grassy riverbank. They swoop
from the trees, grab grub, perch on our rear fence to eat grub, and then
return to their tree perch, before going through the same routine
repeatedly.
Geckos are also very aware of people and they react to my presence when I
talk to them.
Rhonda Cetta-Hoyle wrote:
Spiders are smart. A friend Kathy had a spider's web right accross
where she walked out her back door. Loath to remove it totally she just
made a small area to get throughon one side. This went on for a few
days, when to her amazement the spider instead of weaving a perfect
shaped web, began building though the night a web with the space she
kept removing each day.
This went on for ages. So they can change their thinking to suit thier
enviroment. I don't know what it was maybe a golden orb like Julia's
beautiful story
Mark Lightfoot posted:
Hello again, I've been on leave
from my Canberra hovel (to Shepparton actually) and on my return I
remembered the horrible stories of the white tip/tail spider.
Now I seem to remember reading on
an authoritative website that most white tail bites are misdiagnosed
and are actually tumours/cancers and other miscellaneous things that
the spider has copped the blame for. I'll have a quick look tonight for
some information, but I wondered if we had any resident experts who
could save this spider from it's horrible reputation?
Gerald Cairns replied:
I am not a resident expert, however, it is my view that most of these
instances are due to opportunistic organisms infecting the wound which
probably suffers some necrosis complicating the treatment. I had a
similar experience with a Tiger snake bite many years ago and suffered
a fair bit of toxin mediated localised necrosis which then became
infected. The necrotic effects were terminated by normal treatments for
snake bite but the infection slowed the healing significantly but did
not lead to a permanent or uncontrollable ulcer.
There is another possible dimension to this and that is the possibility
of allergic reactions being set up that could be difficult to control.
