Bill: Let's meet out panel. My guests tonight are the charming and talented stars of the number one movie in America -- "American Pie." First off, she played bunny Lebowski in "The Big Lebowski." And in "American Pie," she is vicky, America's sweetheart -- Tara Reid. Tara!
[ Cheers and Applause ]
Bill: Wow! Hey, you.
Tara: How are you? How you doing?
Bill: Good. She plays Nadia in the move, and her next movies are "Seamless" and "Dish Dog" -- "Dish Dogs," whatever that means -- Shannon Elizabeth. Shannon, hey!
[ Cheers and applause ]
Shannon: Hi, how are you?
Bill: How are you, young lady? Nice to meet you.
Shannon: You, too.
Bill: Thank you for coming. She is one of the stars of "Buffy the Vampire Slayer." In "American Pie" she plays Michelle -- Alyson Hannigan. Alyson, there you are.
[ Cheers and applause ]
Bill:Hey, you.
Alyson: Hi.
Bill: Nice to meet you.
[ Applause ]
Bill:Sit right there. And he made his Broadway debut at the age of 13, and now he's romantically linked with a dessert. The hero of our story -- Jason Biggs. Jason, hey.
[ Cheers and applause ]
Jason: How you doing?
Bill: How are you?
Jason: Nice to meet you.
Bill: Thanks for coming.
Jason: Thanks for having us.
[ Applause ]
Bill: Okay. Well, I guess, by the reaction, some of you have seen this movie, "American Pie" -- ?
[ Cheers ]
Bill: Okay. Well, and you found the pie we left for you in the green room.
[ Laughter ]
Jason: That's why I was a little late.
Bill: But I wanna tell you right away why I liked this. What got me right away -- 'cause I'm sitting in the theater and I -- very soon on, you realize this is about four guys in high school who can't get laid. I wanted to jump out of my seat and say, "Thank you!"
[ Laughter ]
Bill: I have seen so many teen movies in the last three years where it seems like sex is the easiest thing to come by in high school. And that is certainly not my memory of high school.
[ Laughter ]
Bill: And it depicts it realistically where the women rule. 'Cause the younger you go in the dating cycle, the more the women hold the cards, which is why I haven't gotten married yet.
[ Laughter ]
Bill: But don't you think that's true in high school?
Alyson: Definitely.
Tara: Yeah.
Alyson: It's all about whenever a girl wants to give it up, she'll give it to a guy.
Alyson: Yeah, the guy can want it as much as he wants, but it's not till the girl says yes that he's gonna get anything.
Bill: Right.
Jason: Yeah, I hate to admit it.
Alyson: And I don't think that's just high school. It goes into like -- college and everything.
Bill: Oh, no, no. No, no.
[ Laughter ]
Tara: Unless, of course, you have a hit TV show.
Bill: No, no, no. I just mean when women get -- when you get into your 30s, you will, you know, start saying things like, "I need to get laid." Which, you know, that's --
[ Laughter ]
Alyson: Yeah.
Bill: -- That doesn't happen in --
[ Cheers and applause ]
Alyson: But that's what 18-year-old boys are for. Right?
[ Laughter ]
Shannon: I mean, no matter how much a woman wants that, I don't think any woman's ever gonna have a problem finding a guy that is willing to be with her.
Bill: That is true. That is something women, I think, need to recognize more.
[ Laughter ]
Bill: If they had to, they can get laid in ten seconds, and that makes it very different.
Shannon: Hey, you, right now.
[ Laughter ]
Bill: I wanna -- I wanna show you. This was in the paper today. This is very interesting and very apropos to what goes on in your movie. Down in Virginia -- I say "Down" like we're North -- uh, there is a Williamsburg middle school where there is a crisis. They called a meeting of parents because the parents got the call from the principal and they said, "What is it, drugs?" "No." "Is it eating disorders?" "No." Oral sex is a fad now.
[ Light Laughter ]
Tara: I think guys will probably think that's a definitely a pretty good fad.
Bill: I mean, I wept for about an hour because --
Shannon: Well, it's better than bell bottoms, you know?
[ Laughter ]
Tara: 'Cause you're getting some kind of pleasure out of it.
Bill: But you have to understand, when I was -- when I was in high school, this was the ultimate sex act. And now kids seem to see it as a way to prevent loss of virginity, prevent getting AIDS. It's almost like kissing. And --
[ Audience groans ]
Jason: Mmm.
Bill: I'm not -- I'm not kidding about -- this is --
Tara: I don't believe -- I definitely agree with that.
Bill: It is now expected minimum behavior.
Tara: I think -- I think, definitely today, more so when kids -- they do have -- they do have oral sex before they have sex, because they're still keeping their virginity. And a lot of people that don't even have sex, they'll go crazy on oral sex, 'cause like, that's all they do, because they think, "Oh, well, I'm still, you know, clean and a virgin."
Shannon: Right, but I don't think that's any excuse. I mean the things that you've listed for them to say, "Well, you know, I'm avoiding this, this and this, so it should be okay." I don't think that's an excuse for, you know, doing anything like that in high school --
Bill: But that is how they feel.
Shannon: -- opposed to having intercourse.
Alyson: I think it's a lot different for a girl to give oral sex than to receive oral sex. I think that that's sad.
[ Laughter ]
Shannon: Yeah, I agree.
Alyson: I mean, I --
Bill: Well, it's easier. I mean, how could a -- I mean, a guy at that age can't even find what he's looking for.
[ Laughter ]
Alyson: That's why you should start when, you know, early.
Tara: But I think it's good that they're starting early, because, then, when they're our age, they'll really know how to give oral sex.
[ Laughter ]
Alyson: But, see, I don't -- I don't think the guys are starting early is the problem. I don't think the guys start until they are in, like, long-term relationships, they start learning how to pleasure their woman.
Bill: But, when I was in high school, this was like the ultimate thing you could get. This was not something to prevent intercourse. This was after you were practically engaged.
[ Laughter ]
Jason: There's a lot more at risk, though, nowadays, too, with -- with intercourse.
Bill: Yes.
Jason: So I think it's -- you know, it's --
Alyson: There's still risk with oral sex.
Tara: Teen pregnancy, there's AIDS.
Jason: There's still risk with oral sex, but there's more a risk. I mean AIDS is obviously. But, I mean, just pregnancy is --
Tara: Pregnancy. Teen pregnancy's huge.
Jason: I mean pregnancy is such a fear nowadays -- I mean, for kids growing up in high school.
Bill: So you think that's the reason why this is so --
Jason: I think it's -- I think that could be part of the reason. I mean, if it's --
Bill: Why couldn't they have AIDS when I was in high school?
[ Laughter ]
Bill:I tell you, I miss out on all the good things!
Tara: I also think, lately, right now, I mean, oral sex a huge thing. I mean, think about it, that's all we talked about in our country for the last year. So, I think it's a lot more free than it used to be. Before it was more of a --
Jason: If it could be discussed within the presidency --
Tara: Yeah. I mean, before, it used to be a much bigger deal. But I think oral sex is -- the meaning of it has just gone down so much more than it used to be.
Bill: So to speak.
Tara: Yeah.
[ Laughter ]
Tara: Exactly.
Bill: We'll take a break, and we'll come right back. Very, very clever, young lady.
[ Clip from American Pie ]
Bill: Oh, God. That had to be an embarrassing moment for you, even to this day.
Jason: I dealt with it.
[ Laughter ]
Bill: It's dealing -- yeah, it is dealing with it that you to -- that's the other thing I liked about this movie is that they understand that teenage time of life is awkward and awful for all of us. And it's sort of saying to the kids, "You know what? If you feel uncomfortable -- "
Tara: You're not alone.
Shannon: You're not alone.
Bill: You're norm -- that is normal! Don't pick up a gun, pick up what he picked up.
Tara: I think it also says --
[ Laughter ]
Tara: But, I think, one of the things this movie also says -- it's not just the kids is says that to you, I think it's the parents, as well.
Bill: Yeah.
Tara: I mean, in the movie, his dad clearly does not understand his son.
Bill: I love that dad character. But he tries.
Tara: Oh, he's the best. He's tries -- exactly.
Bill: You know, my father did the same thing. He tried badly.
Jason: But at least he tried.
Tara: And it was awful.
Bill: Yes. He said masturbation is a perfectly normal thing for a boy your age, but not at dinner.
[ Laughter ]
Bill: He made that clear.
Alyson: This movie is, like, looking into other teenagers' medicine cabinets.
Bill: Yes.
Alyson: You know, it's really, like, "Oh, God, I'm not alone. Thank you."
Bill: You're not alone.
Alyson: "Whew! I did that."
Bill: And virginity, which is such a big focus of this -- it's sort of the McGuffan in this movie -- uh, I think that's also realistic, that, everybody -- at least the girls, I should say -- wanna keep it up until that last day of high school. And then -- then it's like a piece of snot on your finger. You wanna get rid of it. You don't wanna go to college a virgin, right? Isn't there a paradox there that -- ?
Tara: I think that's -- I think my character, in particular, that -- I mean, she's very, very truthful in that, that it's really important to her. And she does wanna have it. It's not like she wants to stay this virgin. But it's really important to her that it's perfect. And she wants to plan it out. And she really, like, wants it to be dream-like. I mean, she wants the guy to say, "I love you," to her. That's really important to her. And I think, you know, I remember, even when I first had sex, that was a big deal for me. Like, I wanted to be in love with the guy. I wanted him to be in love with me. And I wanted it to be perfect. And, then, once you had it, you realize, "Oh, God, it's not perfect."
Bill: It's -- you're right. The first time is probably never going to be perfect.
Alyson: Never gonna be perfect.
Tara: Never, never.
Jason: No.
Bill: No.
Alyson: But, I think, for girls, it's not really a time line, it's more of the emotional attachment. At least it was in my situation, where, you know, I wanted to be emotionally attached.
Bill: But it is kind of like getting your driver's license. You just have to go through it.
Tara: That's true. Once you do it, it's so much better.
Bill: Right.
Tara: The first one's horrible. It gets better and better the more you do it.
Alyson: Yeah, and after a couple accidents, you know, you're all right.
Shannon: But it's not as important to a girl to do it at an early age as it is to the guys 'cause guys are like, "Oh, my friends are making fun of me." Girls do it at an early age --
[ All talking at once ]
Bill: But they don't wanna leave high school a virgin.
[ All talking at once ]
Alyson: A guy in high school has more pressure to lose his virginity than a girl. It's actually looked down upon if a girl loses her virginity at too early of an age.
Shannon: Right.
Alyson: You're a slut.
Shannon: Exactly.
Tara: I don't think -- I don't think necessarily it's so much at the early age. But, if you're starting to fool around with someone, and you're a girl in high school, and you have a boyfriend, and you're fooling around, and you're getting yourself extremely horny, what is there left to do? So, I think that's where sex comes in. It's not so much about the age. It has to do where you are in that particular relationship or at what point you are in the heat of the moment. And I think that's when sometimes it comes to.
Bill: Could you talk slower?
[ Laughter ]
Bill: We'll take a commercial and towel off. And we'll be right back.
[ Clip from American Pie ]
Tara: Like I said.
Bill: We are here with the cast of "American Pie." That's another clip from the movie. And, obviously, that's the mother of one of the kids in the movie. And I -- you know, it's the "Mrs. Robinson" syndrome. We all laugh at that when the 38-year-old woman wants to bag the 18-year-old guy. If you did it in the reverse, you would be picketed. If there was a 38-year-old man who was, you know, mackin' on some high school girl, now that's a double standard. My question is -- is that okay?
Shannon: You have to take into account that he did make the first move on her, and --
[ Laughter ]
Shannon: I don't -- I don't think -- I don't think women are given enough credit to know what they're doing and to take responsibility for their actions. We live in a society that's still really run by men. And they think, you know, if an older man is making the first move on a younger woman, they're taking advantage of her. They don't give her credit for her maybe knowing what she's doing, as well, and maybe being just as responsible as the man.
Bill: Monica Lewinsky -- a perfect example of someone who really made the first move, and I mean move.
[ Laughter ]
Bill: Right? So is that the appropriate? Is that okay?
Jason: Why not? I mean -- yeah. I mean, if -- first of all, you're supposed to assume that an 18-year-old is mature enough to make his or her own decisions. Um, and, uh, if both parties --
Bill: Which is silly.
Jason: Which is -- no. I don't think so. I don't think so. I mean, at 18, I consider myself mature enough to make a decision as to whether or not I would be with an older woman. I'm not saying I was, but I'm saying I would consider myself --
Bill: Yes.
Jason: You know, I just felt that I could --
Bill: I considered myself an astronaut when I was 18.
[ Laughter ]
Bill: I was --
Jason: No, but -- I mean, uh -- no, I mean, I think -- I think it's okay if it's an older guy and ayounger woman. I mean, yeah, it's like we look at the guy, like, "Oh, he's a dirty, old man."
Tara: I mean, you always go back to the situation where you have it like a lolita. You know? And that was like -- the movie wouldn't even sell. You know.
Bill: They would not even release it here. Exactly.
Tara: They wouldn't even release it. Exactly.
Bill: It's so taboo.
Tara: And when you see this, you know, it's hilarious. You know, so --
Alyson: But you're also talking an 18-year-old boy compared to a 12-year-old girl.
Tara: I think when you cut -- when you cut that it's 18, you know, verse -- if it was a 12-year-old boy, it would, you know, that's getting a little sick, you know?
Bill: But, in nature, people, sexually, are not matched by their exact ages. Women reach their peak at about the age that woman is. And a guy reaches his peak at about -- that is actually the appropriate coupling.
Tara: But also --
[ Laughter ]
Tara: I mean --
[ Cheers and applause ]
Alyson: It's true.
Tara: And I think it's a -- I think it's also a young guy's fantasy to sleep with someone's mom. I mean, I think that --
Alyson: Well, also --
Bill: Right.
Tara: And I think that a girl has the same kind of fantasy to sleep with the older man.
Bill: Well, thank God.
Tara: There's always --
[ Laughter ]
Tara: There's always -- that's always gonna be there. And I think the reason why we say it's wrong is because we've almost been programmed to think it's wrong. And when you really think about it realistically, is it really wrong? If you really look at it, it really might not be wrong. But we have been so programmed to think, "It's wrong, it's wrong," that we just assume it's wrong.
Bill: Right. It's a hallmark of political correctness -- that a mismatch of ages is somehow a perversion. We know that's not true. Right?
Tara: Exactly.
Alyson: Bottom line, that's the choice --
[ Laughter ]
Tara: That's true, though.
[ Applause ]
Alyson: But that's the choice. And it is purely physical. And I think that if you look at a 12-year-old girl or a younger girl and an older man, you realize that the girl is more emotionally involved, and they've assumed the guy isn't, and he's just trying to, um, you know --
Bill: Well, you know what happens when you assume? You make an ass out of "U" and "Me." All right, kids, that's the lesson for today. We'll take a commercial and we'll come back.
Bill: Okay. Appropriate to the cast of "American Pie," who we are here with, a new phenomenon this year with graduation, which took place last month. Get this, they are digitally re-enhancing yearbook photos now. There's a kid who got -- they quoted many examples, but a kid shaved his head right before the yearbook photo was taken. Well, they put hair on him in the picture. They can take away your braces.
Tara: That's awful.
Alyson: That's so ridiculous, because yearbooks's sole purpose is to look back 20 years from then and see what an idiot you were.
[ Laughter ]
Bill: Speaking of which, I have mine. Show my yearbook picture, and we'll show something that is not --
[ Laughter ]
[ Cheers and applause ]
Tara: That's great.
Bill: There is, uh --
Tara: That's exactly what --
Bill: There is an example of no digital re-enhancement, ladies and gentlemen.
Tara: But that's what that -- you know, that's exactly what you love about yearbook pictures, you look back and you say, "Oh, my God, I can't believe I wore that. I can't believe I did that."
Alyson: "And that's why I didn't get laid."
[ Laughter ]
Bill: There were many other reasons, but that was the beginning of it, yes.
Tara: But the worst part is if their digitally enhancing it and it's not with kids' consent. I mean, if parents, you know, want -- they don't like that their kid's a skinhead and throwing hair on him, that's absolutely awful.
Jason: It's one thing to disagree with your kid's style or how they dress, whatever. It's one thing to disagree with it and you talk about it with them about it. But it's another thing to actually, you know, take that next step and say, "All right, you wanna be a skin? Well, I'm gonna put hair on your head for your photos."
Alyson: That's another way of darting around the issues. It's like, "Oh, I'll blame the photo."
Shannon: You have a big enough complex as it is in high school, you know, with peer pressure and everything else going on. And a lot of kids feel like they need to make their own statement and be their own person. And for their own parents to be taking that away from them and telling them, "There's something wrong with you, I'm gonna fix it for you," I mean, kids are gonna be afraid to make any decisions for themselves because everybody's gonna be behind them saying, "You're wrong, you're wrong. I'm gonna change it. I'm gonna fix it." And everybody's gonna be afraid. I mean, it's hard enough growing up without your own parents being against you.